I had the day off from work and decided to give crystal malt another shot. I used a pound of various crystal malts in a 7.5 pound grist (my standard batch size is 3.66 gallons). Here’s the grain bill:
6.5 pounds of Avangard Pils
3/8ths of a pound of Avangard Caramel 8L (more of a dextrin malt than a true crystal malt)
3/8ths of a pound of MFB CaraVienne
1/4th of a pound Dingeman’s Special B
O.G. 1.064 for 3.66 gallons
What hops and yeast?
That’s kind of a lot of Special B. Your beer will taste like Special B. Hope you like it. I love it.
you picked some good ones, certainly.
caravienne is probably, along with Belgian caramunich, my personal favorite.
I used a hop that I grew for which there is no name. I sent 150 grams to Alpha Analytics for analysis. The hop looks like Zeus from an alpha, beta, and volatile oil point of view. However, after brewing with it, I can confirm that it is not Zeus; therefore, I am taking an NCGR scientist’s advice and giving it a name until I can find a match. I had a couple of names in mind, but the one that has stuck is Verde e Rosso, which I have shortened to Verde Rosso. Verde e Rosso is Italian for “green and red,” which is the color of the bine.
Hopping Schedule:
1/2 ounce of the hop formally known as “unknown” 16.4% AA, 1.81% v/w (1.81ml of oil per 100 grams of cones), 60 minute boil
1 ounce of the hop formally known as “unknown” 16.4% AA, 1.81% v/w (1.81ml of oil per 100 grams of cones), 20 minute hop stand at 160F
I pitched Bry 97. I have several very nice strains in my bank that are unobtainable via the home brew trade, but Siebel Bry 97 (a.k.a. Ballentine “Ale” Brewery, “Anchor,” Wyeast 1272, White Labs WLP051, and Lallemand Bry 97) seems to have the perfect balance of characteristics for a modern hoppy beer. It’s not as bland tasting as Siebel Bry 96 (a.k.a. Ballentine “Beer” Brewey, “Chico,” Wyeast 1056, White Labs WLP001, and Fermentis US-05), nor is it as dry. The only downside to using this strain is that it has a fairly long lag period.
I thought that I had made a serious mistake adding Special B to the grist, but the wort was fairly Pils-forward going into the fermentation vessel. Avangard Pils is a strongly flavored Pils malt. I also added CaCl2 to the mash, which tends to enhance Pils malt flavor. Special B has a surprising amount of coloring power.
Interesting… I look forward to hearing how it turns out. Post a picture of the pint when it’s ready with a flavor profile, please!
+1. In a good way, I think. Yeah, Special B definitely has a big color (and flavor) contribution as well.
I’m very interested to hear your assessment of the mystery cones after the hop stand.
Quality Pils malt and Special B is a recipe for success, IMO. I use 4 ounces/3 gallons in all my dark Belgians, so I’d say you’re right in the butter zone. Sounds like a real tasty brew.
That is way too much crystal malt. You are going to hate that beer. Hope you have a bunch of dumb, gullible neighbors.
I fear that you may be right. I had to give crystal malt another shot after dannyjed wrote “Crystal Haters…c’mon guys it’s Crystal malt not Crystal meth.”
Believe it or not, there was a time when I was not a crystal malt hater. However, that was a long time ago when one could have any base malt that one wanted as long as it was Briess or Schreier 2-Row brewer’s malt.
+1 Ha ha ha
I’m glad you’re giving it another shot 
I’m enjoying a Pale Ale that I made using 8.5 lbs Avangard Pils, 1lb Avangard Munich, 1 lb Vienna, and .5 lb Crystal 40. It has a nice hoppy, dry finish.
I fall into that camp of “too much crystal ruins a good beer” too. I tend to “top out” at about a lb in a 5 gallon batch as being that tipping point in a pale ale type beer. I’m afraid your small batch size comes out almost twice that level.
That said, I hope you’ll try it again but scale down the crystal malts so you end up with roughly a half pound in 2.5 gals. I think you’ll like the crystal again if its used with restraint. It definitely has its place.
HTH-
This ^
The batch size is 3.66 gallons. Avangard Caramel 8L is not really crystal malt. It’s what Avangard calls their CaraPils/Dextrin malt. CaraPils has none of the flavors that we associate with the true crystal malts. The two true crystal malt additions add up to 5/8ths of a pound, which is a lower ratio per gallon than a pound per 5 gallons. Sixteen ounces of crystal in 5 gallons results equates to 3.2 ounces of crystal malt per gallon whereas 10 ounces in 3.66 gallons equates to 2.73 ounces per pound.
Here are the grist percentages:
86.67% Pils
5% CaraPils
5% CaraVienne
3.33% Special B
As mentioned above, CaraPils is not really crystal malt; therefore, the beer has 8.33% crystal malt, which is way over the top for me. However, it is par for the course for many brewers.
With that said, the malt that has me worried is Special B. That stuff is intensely flavored.
Special B isn’t exactly the malt I’d choose if I wanted to evaluate my impressions on Crystal malt in general. I love the stuff, but it’s a distinct flavor that I wouldn’t necessarily equate with other Crystal malts.
My recommendation for giving Crystal a good taste test would be:
93% UK Pale Ale malt of your preference
7% Dark English Crystal
WY1968
35 IBU’s and ~1 oz late hops of the UK hops of your choice
dry hop with EKG
I know that Wy1968 is a wildly popular strain, but I have never cared for the Fuller’s strain. I prefer the fermentation profile of its kissing cousin Wy1768 (Young’s). If I had to go back to using liquid yeast, I would probably stick with Brewtek CL-50 (a.k.a. Wyeast 1450). I have a couple of British strains that I have to yet use. I plan to use them as soon as the weather turns cold and the airborne microflora count drops. I also have bank maintenance to perform, so I will not be using any home brew trade yeast strains once that activity starts.
I have not dry hopped anything in at least 19 years. Like my “everything needs crystal malt” period, I went through a period where everything that I brewed was dry-hopped to some extent. I abandoned the technique after building a hopback. I prefer late hopping to dry hopping, especially when using English cultivars. Lately, I am digging 20 minute hop stands at 71C (~160F). Hop stands at this temperature mimic the flavor and aroma produced by a hopback very well while allowing one to get out of having to clean and sanitize a counterflow or plate chiller.
Good tip. I think I will try that.
+1 to WY1450 and hopstands - I love both. And I like the cooler hopstands like you mention the best. The flavor (and aroma ) are better at cooler temps IMO. I’m down in the 170 - 165F range now, working my way incrementally down the temp scale to see what I like best. So 160F would be next.