# Spring Water **URL:** \ **Category:** Brewing Processes\ **Created:** [March 15, 2016, 10:14pm UTC](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749 "2016-03-15T22:14:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![flbrewer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/brewersassociation/user_avatar/forum.homebrewersassociation.org/flbrewer/32/6296_2.png) [@flbrewer](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/u/flbrewer)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2016, 10:14pm UTC](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749/1 "2016-03-15T22:14:40Z")
I’m considering switching to spring water (Zephyrhills here in Florida) over my current routine of RO. The reason is that there is obviously more of an already build up water profile for me to work with. They report online but there are some issues. It’s from 2013, there are 5 different springs listed as possible sources. Additionally, the minerals I’m interested in are listed with ranges. Calcium for instance, is listed as 3.3-16. Sodium, 2.2-8.5, etc. Any thoughts to how different these sources are? My other thought is that these numbers aren’t a big leap from starting from zero. Most of the ranges are tighter averaging about 5 ppm…probably not an issue if I pick the median? Here’s the report if you’re interested… [http://www.nestle-watersna.com/asset-library/Documents/ZH\_BWQR.pdf](http://www.nestle-watersna.com/asset-library/Documents/ZH_BWQR.pdf) ---
**Author:** ![pmorrissette](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/brewersassociation/user_avatar/forum.homebrewersassociation.org/pmorrissette/32/2952_2.png) [@pmorrissette](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/u/pmorrissette)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2016, 10:22pm UTC](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749/2 "2016-03-15T22:22:33Z")
Other than the recent beer, have you had any issues with your RO water? Is it significantly more expensive than the spring water? I feel like trading RO water, with known mineral additions, for the spring water you detail would be a step in the wrong direction. You’re going from a more or less certainty to a more uncertain method. ---
**Author:** ![flbrewer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/brewersassociation/user_avatar/forum.homebrewersassociation.org/flbrewer/32/6296_2.png) [@flbrewer](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/u/flbrewer)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2016, 10:30pm UTC](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749/3 "2016-03-15T22:30:09Z")
> [@](#): > > Other than the recent beer, have you had any issues with your RO water? Is it significantly more expensive than the spring water? > > I feel like trading RO water, with known mineral additions, for the spring water you detail would be a step in the wrong direction. You’re going from a more or less certainty to a more uncertain method. No, not that I know of. I’ve only used Gypsum and CaCl to date, which gives me calcium, chloride and sulfates. I’m stuck with no way to build up magnesium or sodium currently. I know there are ways to build this up, but haven’t tried yet. ---
**Author:** ![pmorrissette](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/brewersassociation/user_avatar/forum.homebrewersassociation.org/pmorrissette/32/2952_2.png) [@pmorrissette](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/u/pmorrissette)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2016, 10:35pm UTC](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749/4 "2016-03-15T22:35:19Z")
With my RO water, I use gypsum, calcium chloride, and epsom salt. (Magnesium chloride/MgSO4\*H2O) I’ve also got some 10% phosphoric acid that I’ll use if needed. With those three, I’ve never had any issues getting the “core” minerals needed. I think Martin has said that magnesium isn’t always needed? Anyway, I’ve left it out on occasion and haven’t had any glaring issues. ---
**Author:** ![flbrewer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/brewersassociation/user_avatar/forum.homebrewersassociation.org/flbrewer/32/6296_2.png) [@flbrewer](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/u/flbrewer)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2016, 10:44pm UTC](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749/5 "2016-03-15T22:44:39Z")
> [@](#): > > With my RO water, I use gypsum, calcium chloride, and epsom salt. (Magnesium chloride/MgSO4\*H2O) I’ve also got some 10% phosphoric acid that I’ll use if needed. > > With those three, I’ve never had any issues getting the “core” minerals needed. I think Martin has said that magnesium isn’t always needed? Anyway, I’ve left it out on occasion and haven’t had any glaring issues. (Magnesium chloride/MgSO4\*H2O) Can you elaborate on what this is? ---
**Author:** ![system](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/brewersassociation/original/1X/f1a2211dcb353b921ed70873794a31db2031eccc.png) [@system](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/u/system)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2016, 10:45pm UTC](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749/6 "2016-03-15T22:45:05Z")
Switching to the spring water will not help you meet your pH goals. It will complicate the use of your spreadsheet because now you’ll have to enter that profile as the base water profile and because the profile is not specific you’ll be guessing. The spring water is close enough to RO water that you might as well stick with the RO. Here’s a suggestion (that’ll meet with resistance)!  Buy the spring water and brew with it.  Don’t adjust it, just brew with it, no calculators no worrying about pH just make a beer!  Or better yet, use your RO water or tap water! ---
**Author:** ![jonhughey\_att.net](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/brewersassociation/user_avatar/forum.homebrewersassociation.org/jonhughey_att.net/32/6277_2.png) [@jonhughey\_att.net](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/u/jonhughey_att.net)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2016, 10:46pm UTC](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749/7 "2016-03-15T22:46:35Z")
Here’s the resistance - chlorine and/or chloramines from tap water? Pass. Edit - Even using campden, local water supplies can vary from month to month, season to season. To each his own. ---
**Author:** ![pmorrissette](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/brewersassociation/user_avatar/forum.homebrewersassociation.org/pmorrissette/32/2952_2.png) [@pmorrissette](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/u/pmorrissette)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2016, 10:49pm UTC](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749/8 "2016-03-15T22:49:23Z")
> [@flbrewer](#): > > > [@](#): > > > > With my RO water, I use gypsum, calcium chloride, and epsom salt. (Magnesium chloride/MgSO4\*H2O) I’ve also got some 10% phosphoric acid that I’ll use if needed. > > > > With those three, I’ve never had any issues getting the “core” minerals needed. I think Martin has said that magnesium isn’t always needed? Anyway, I’ve left it out on occasion and haven’t had any glaring issues. > > (Magnesium chloride/MgSO4\*H2O) > > Can you elaborate on what this is? Epsom salt. Can be found in just about any grocery store, in food grade form. Few things are better for an ingrown toe nail or sore ankle than a soak in hot water and epsom salt. > **[Magnesium sulfate](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnesium_sulfate)** > > .mw-parser-output .ib-chembox{border-collapse:collapse;text-align:left}.mw-parser-output .ib-chembox td,.mw-parser-output .ib-chembox th{border:1px solid #a2a9b1;width:40%}.mw-parser-output .ib-chembox td+td{width:60%} > Magnesium sulfate or magnesium sulphate is a chemical compound, a salt with the formula MgSO4, consisting of magnesium cations Mg2+ (20.19% by mass) and sulfate anions SO2−4. It is a white crystalline solid, soluble in water but not in ethanol. > Magnesium sulfate is usually encou... I believe there’s an entry point for it in bru’n water. Note: Epsom salt is also a laxative. I doubt you’d use it in enough quantity to cause problems when brewing, but I certainly wouldn’t overdo it. ---
**Author:** ![system](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/brewersassociation/original/1X/f1a2211dcb353b921ed70873794a31db2031eccc.png) [@system](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/u/system)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2016, 10:49pm UTC](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749/9 "2016-03-15T22:49:33Z")
> [@](#): > > Here’s the resistance - chlorine and/or chloramines from tap water? Pass. Seriously?  Common sense would dictate that depending on the level of chlorine/chloramine you may not even have to worry about it.  If you’re really concerned crush a campden tablet and put half in your strike water and half in sparge water. ---
**Author:** ![jonhughey\_att.net](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/brewersassociation/user_avatar/forum.homebrewersassociation.org/jonhughey_att.net/32/6277_2.png) [@jonhughey\_att.net](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/u/jonhughey_att.net)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2016, 10:50pm UTC](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749/10 "2016-03-15T22:50:29Z")
> [@](#): > > > [@](#): > > > > Here’s the resistance - chlorine and/or chloramines from tap water? Pass. > > Seriously?  Common sense would dictate that depending on the level of chlorine/chloramine you may not even have to worry about it.  If you’re really concerned crush a campden tablet and put half in your strike water and half in sparge water. You missed my edit, also about local water supplies varying throughout the year. ---
**Author:** ![jmitchell3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/brewersassociation/user_avatar/forum.homebrewersassociation.org/jmitchell3/32/11952_2.png) [@jmitchell3](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/u/jmitchell3)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2016, 10:51pm UTC](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749/11 "2016-03-15T22:51:35Z")
Yeah go with RO. Adjust with gypsum and caCl to get to desired chloride to sulfate ratio for style along with minimum calcium (50 ppm or so) required for good fermentation. Continue to use lactic like you’ve been doing to adjust further as needed for target mash ph. Use brunwater at 100% ro dilution then go from there. ---
**Author:** ![jonhughey\_att.net](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/brewersassociation/user_avatar/forum.homebrewersassociation.org/jonhughey_att.net/32/6277_2.png) [@jonhughey\_att.net](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/u/jonhughey_att.net)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2016, 10:53pm UTC](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749/12 "2016-03-15T22:53:05Z")
> [@jmitchell3](#): > > Yeah go with RO. Adjust with gypsum and caCl to get to desired chloride to sulfate ratio for style along with minimum calcium (50 ppm or so) required for good fermentation. Continue to use lactic like you’ve been doing to adjust further as needed for target mash ph. Use brunwater at 100% ro dilution then go from there. > > Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk +1 ---
**Author:** ![wort-h.o.g](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/brewersassociation/user_avatar/forum.homebrewersassociation.org/wort-h.o.g/32/11975_2.png) [@wort-h.o.g](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/u/wort-h.o.g)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2016, 11:09pm UTC](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749/13 "2016-03-15T23:09:44Z")
lifeless water=lifeless beer IMO.  use your minerals and target…better tasting beer will result. ---
**Author:** ![jonhughey\_att.net](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/brewersassociation/user_avatar/forum.homebrewersassociation.org/jonhughey_att.net/32/6277_2.png) [@jonhughey\_att.net](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/u/jonhughey_att.net)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2016, 11:14pm UTC](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749/14 "2016-03-15T23:14:21Z")
Yep. It’s 2 phase for me (and most of us) - pH control and flavor. The right profile can make a good beer great. ---
**Author:** ![pmorrissette](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/brewersassociation/user_avatar/forum.homebrewersassociation.org/pmorrissette/32/2952_2.png) [@pmorrissette](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/u/pmorrissette)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2016, 11:15pm UTC](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749/15 "2016-03-15T23:15:22Z")
My beers were terrible when I used tap water. My city water is about as bad for brewing as it can get, no calcium and high levels of sodium. I’ve no idea if it’s softened at the treatment plant or what, but it makes awful beer. Really bad mineral flavor that wouldn’t go away. I got lucky in that 5.2 pH buffer helped, but only once I started learning about water chemistry and using Bru’n water did my beer turn the corner. It’s freed me up to tackle other issues. I really don’t worry much about pH, I target 5.4 in Bru’n water regardless of style and leave it at that for now. ---
**Author:** ![wort-h.o.g](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/brewersassociation/user_avatar/forum.homebrewersassociation.org/wort-h.o.g/32/11975_2.png) [@wort-h.o.g](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/u/wort-h.o.g)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2016, 11:22pm UTC](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749/16 "2016-03-15T23:22:39Z")
> [@](#): > > My beers were terrible when I used tap water. My city water is about as bad for brewing as it can get, no calcium and high levels of sodium. I’ve no idea if it’s softened at the treatment plant or what, but it makes awful beer. Really bad mineral flavor that wouldn’t go away. > > I got lucky in that 5.2 pH buffer helped, but only once I started learning about water chemistry and using Bru’n water did my beer turn the corner. It’s freed me up to tackle other issues. > > I really don’t worry much about pH, I target 5.4 in Bru’n water regardless of style and leave it at that for now. Not a bad place to be Phil. You have a process you can manage and repeat- half the battle. ---
**Author:** ![pmorrissette](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/brewersassociation/user_avatar/forum.homebrewersassociation.org/pmorrissette/32/2952_2.png) [@pmorrissette](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/u/pmorrissette)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2016, 11:28pm UTC](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749/17 "2016-03-15T23:28:56Z")
To be fair - I plan on tackling pH in more detail, I just don’t have the drive to do so right now. With only some of my beers getting temp controlled fermentations, I still have other fish to fry. ---
**Author:** ![jonhughey\_att.net](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/brewersassociation/user_avatar/forum.homebrewersassociation.org/jonhughey_att.net/32/6277_2.png) [@jonhughey\_att.net](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/u/jonhughey_att.net)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2016, 11:33pm UTC](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749/18 "2016-03-15T23:33:58Z")
My water here is pretty horrendous, too. Used straight it’s good for a very roasty black beer and little else. Even if it were consistently crappy, I could at least account for it and blend for some beers. But I’ve had it tested multiple times and get noticeably different results from Ward each time. I’m long over it - I build up from RO (verified by TDS meter) and make consistently good beer. Word to the wise - depending on where you live your water makeup can change throughout the year, sometimes drastically. One Ward test may not tell the whole story. ---
**Author:** ![skatz](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/brewersassociation/user_avatar/forum.homebrewersassociation.org/skatz/32/6982_2.png) [@skatz](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/u/skatz)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2016, 12:56am UTC](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749/19 "2016-03-16T00:56:32Z")
My water is awful at over 450 ppm TDS and much of it is carbonate. Throw in the chloramine and it is a no-brainer for me. The water also comes from many sources from day to day, so the only way I could count on it is if I measured the minerals every time. I bet I could make a great stout with dechlorinated tap water. I heard from the guy at the water store, my water comes from a dedicated store now (weird), that another town nearby has over 1200ppm TDS. ---
**Author:** ![hopfenundmalz](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/brewersassociation/user_avatar/forum.homebrewersassociation.org/hopfenundmalz/32/11193_2.png) [@hopfenundmalz](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/u/hopfenundmalz)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2016, 1:00am UTC](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749/20 "2016-03-16T01:00:36Z")
Epsom Salt that we buy is the MgSO47H2O. Just saying. [Next page](https://forum.homebrewersassociation.org/t/spring-water/22749.md?page=2)