Thanks so much for taking the time!
Much appreciated
For context, it’s also important to mention that Bamforth has always stated that his observations apply to pro brewing.
And exposure to oxygen given the square-cube law is much, much lower in pro brewing vs home brewing, everything else being the same.
Cheers!
Absolutely. He makes it clear that he’s not a homebrewer in every interview I’ve heard.
I’m still researching that square-cube law. [emoji23] (when an object increases in size, it’s volume increases faster that it’s area). Makes sense. They use larger vessels so surface area is smaller in relation to volume than our little vessels.
As I said is no doubt packaging proficiency is utmost and work back from there. The easiest way is to take a pale ale/ipa, package it, if you do not see ANY hop fade/flavor change during the ENTIRE life of it, thats a good start. Hop fade and flavor change IS oxidation.
Since we are on the Bamforth train…Excerpts from his “Freshness” (2017) book.
Thanks for the reference. I see no inconsistency between what’s listed in bold which are his “primary concerns” and his past comments. …even from his article published this month. The text that is italicized is a “secondary concern” and normal text is of “less concern” and may (his emphasis) help.
I have a dislike for Pils malt probably due to to the Herbstoff. I’ve found Mecca Grade ‘Pilsner-style’ malt doesn’t give me the objectionable taste. Maybe the Full Pint barley they use has less of something (Lipoxygenase (LOX) enzyme?) that Continental barley does or the method they use to malt develops less. [emoji2369]
Thanks for sharing this - lots of cool food for thought here, including some factors that I either wasn’t aware of or haven’t considered.
Re: inactivation of LOX at saccharification temps - if this is the case, wouldn’t mashing in warmer to ensure rapid denaturation of LOX address most of the concerns we have? I see 65C(149F) given as the denaturation temp for malt LOX, so if we target a mash-in temp in the low or mid 150s, wouldn’t that inactivate LOX before it can create problems?
The other point I didn’t realize was that dry hops can potentially add divalent metal cations. A) I wonder is this is why I get a metallic character from some hop varieties, and B) I wonder if adding BTB along with dry hop additions would be beneficial.
It wasn’t meant to be snippy. I apologize if it came across that way.
All I am saying is you’re using folks that don’t seem to support your position given statements they’ve made in writing or interviews as strongly as SN’s practices would. Maybe you should use SN practices vs Dr Bamforth’s wrings to support your position.
I absolutely don’t believe you are the only one who has to support your position at all. I supported mine with quotes from several sources but you didn’t accept them. I’ve even agreed with you but you don’t accept it either. So… I think we’re at an impasse.
Now wait here, you brought up Bamforth, it’s your citing of his words (and subsequent clarification) that was the start of all the bamforth talk.
Never did I once reject your sources, only offered a forrest instead of a tree of reasoning. I even showed some excerpts from his book, that corroborated with you.
The individual thought comment, as well is confusing. You think the senior QA advisor doesn’t have some say in beer production?
We are only at an impasse because you think we at odds. I have kept everything I have said pretty inert(pun intended).
