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note he said 36, whereas I said 30.
also, note I said MY beers.
I am extremely capable of judging my own beers. If they are not up to par, I am not entering them in competitions.
And yes, there are exceptions with areas I’m far from an expert on…oh, wait, I said THAT too.
…if you’re going to attribute something to me, get it right.
In general (but there are exceptions) a beer scoring in the mid 30’s doesn’t medal. Of course this depends on the quality of the other entries. But in general until it’s scoring 37-38 it doesn’t even make it to mini-bos to be in the running for a medal… If the ‘general’ scores are low for all the entires in a category that’s when you’ll start to see mid 30’s medal because they were actually pushed up to mini-bos.
You guys must live in generous scoring areas because scores of 40+ appear to be very rare in my area. Judges around here are reticent to give a score above 35. A score of 40 pretty much guarantees that a beer medals in BOS. A 37 is a solid first place, and a 37 is a darn good beer that is almost perfect style-wise.
With respect to my beer, it had an O.G. of 1.060, which is within style. The beer had an apparent attenuation of 80%. That’s how I received “sweet” and “dry” comments on the same beer. The “less body” comment pretty much tells me that judges are not expecting a “big” beer in 2C. One attribute that I knew was going to be a problem going into the contest was carbonation. I brew beer to drink and share with friends and family. I am not into gassy beer. I chose to enter this beer into the contest because it was truly one of those “Wow!” beers that totally catches one by surprise. I have brewed the same basic recipe many times with different yeast strains, a slightly lower gravity, and a double mash over the years. I bumped the gravity up five points, used flaked maize instead of corn grits, and performed a single decoction mash. I also used a true pre-Prohibition yeast strain, which is highly flocculent.
I’m so proud that my random posts go 5 pages and end in an argument.
For what its worth, yeast, I saw about 35 beers judged. One was below 20 until I was talked into rasing my score. One was over 40.
You guys must live in generous scoring areas because scores of 40+ appear to be very rare in my area. Judges around here are reticent to give a score above 35. A score of 40 pretty much guarantees that a beer medals in BOS. A 37 is a solid first place, and a 37 is a darn good beer that is almost perfect style-wise.
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This is just weird to me. “Almost perfect” to me would mean 45+. I mean, if no one ever gives a mid 40 or above score, then it is not a 50 point scale, it’s a 40 point scale.
This thread serves as a reminder of why I don’t enter competitions.
If I like it, it’s good. If my wife likes it, it’s awesome.
This is just weird to me. “Almost perfect” to me would mean 45+. I mean, if no one ever gives a mid 40 or above score, then it is not a 50 point scale, it’s a 40 point scale.
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I hear ya. But I think of it this way. 50 would be a top beer in that style, fresh off the tap at the brewery, and their best run of that beer ever. Our 35 version was packaged and shipped and fumbled around, and still is only 15 points below it. Not bad really.
You judged 35 different entries in one day or over two days? Even over two days, that’s over 17 beers in a day. I know you’re a newer judge, but most competitions should be striving to keep entries down to 10 - 12 per day (that’s an am/pm session) to keep the feedback quality up and judge wear down low. The checklist style score sheet helps, but not that much…
35 in a day over 3 flights is certainly more than ideal. Over 2 days? - no biggie.
This First Round I did 11 pilsners, 8 English Browns one day and 8 Scottish/Irish, 7-8 English Pale, and 5 Straight mead the next. I was tired, but I attribute that more to the crappy hotel bed and 6 hours of driving.
The competitions that I have worked have had that many entries per flight.
From what I have experienced, the last ten points are reserved for beers that have the pixie dust treatment. We are talking about beers that easily surpass commercial examples.
True, but they usually split a large flight between several groups of judges and then do a mini-BOS, correct?
As a judge, it usually takes me about 10 - 15 minutes to evaluate a beer, write up the score sheet (traditional not checklist style), and discuss the entry with the other judge. This doesn’t include the time that it takes to do a mini-BOS either. I purposefully avoid competitions that treat judges like factory machines to pump out entries. My point, since this is a thread about Noob judging experiences, was that most competitions don’t ask their judges to do 19 entries in a single day like udubdawg did. Quality feedback should be the priority at competitions, not blowing through large numbers of entries. How did your hand feel afterwards?
I dont recall precisely how many but 3 sessions of about a dozen each.
3 hours of driving to KC did a lot more to make my arm sore than the writing. I put comments on each checklist scoresheet too, though I did see some who did not.
FWIW, next to our table was a table of 12 Amber Lagers. However they finished first because they had 2 teams doing 6 beers each, and the Dark Lager flight on Saturday also had 2 teams for 11 beers. 11 was not a normal flight length in this competition. I haven’t seen any other categories that asked that of judges.
I’ve done as many as 14 regular scoresheets in a flight. Not fun. In those cases I’ve pleaded with organizers to set up a third session, get more teams per category, and make the flights short. breaks help a great deal. judging 8, lunch, 8, break, 8 is easier than 12, lunch, 12.
I judged 10 beers on the a.m flight and 9 beers on the p.m flight at the competition that I recently judged. The only flights that were split were those that had 16+ entries.
Nineteen or so entries between two flights appears to be norm in my area.
I felt like that once. I judged 17 beers for a Commercial Judging Competition. Of course this is the only competition that I know that pays it’s judges. They sent out $50 checks to everyone that judged so no one really complains judging 15-20 beers.
In recent years, I’ve started to view guideline differently. I used to brew to style and chase medals. Not anymore. Some of the best commercial beers are technically out of style in some way. Now, I value a score sheet if the judge detects a flaw (DMS, diacetyl, etc…). That can tell me to reevaluate my process. Otherwise, I make it my goal to brew a great tasting beer, regardless of style guidelines. I know I can brew classic styles. Now, I just tweek a classic style to my taste, BJCP be damned :). Of course that will hurt me sometimes in judging, but I’m ok with that.
I’m not sure I would bother entering a beer into a competition using the BJCP guidelines if it didn’t meet those guidelines. Seems like wasted effort to me. Competitions that use the guidelines are exactly for those that are brewing to the style guidelines. I just mean to say I’m not sure what value you would get out of it. I assume if you brew often and have entered many competitions you have an understanding of off flavors.
I agree. I recently was lucky enough to have a Grand Master II judge three of my beers. He really enjoyed two of them. But the best comment he wrote on all three score sheets was " No technical faults"