I’m not a competition guy (although I organize several). I’ve won medals, but truthfully, I’m so busy and lazy that I can’t be bothered to bottle anything.
The AHA does spend time and energy on the competitions like the NHC, the Club Only Comps and the Pro-Am (with the BA in general). Most of that work is done by volunteers with Janis keeping an supervisory eye over it. It’s time well spent because competition keeps a sizable audience engaged and energized. It also provides the group a convenient lever to build contests and rewards around. Put a group of people together in something that takes skill to pull off and at some point, someone will want to prove they can do it better.
Does someone winning tons of medals mean they’re a better brewer? Not really. It means they have a tight process and know how to make beer that judges find appealing. There is a lot to learn from that, but it doesn’t really mean that they enjoy the beer more than you or your friends do.
And all those folks you see running around at the conference working for the AHA? All but 3.5 of them really are BA employees. (The exceptions being Gary, Kate, Janis and half of Jill)
If you don’t like to compete, then do what I do and don’t.
We go to the NHC and have a great time - that is why we keep going back. I would be glad to talk to any of you at the next NHC - especially those I have already met at previous ones.
I enter in some competitions, but not that many. One thing at the NHC, is that if you have a beer in the second round, you tend to pay more attention during the banquet. I have found this to work for me.
I enter a lot of comps, but I certainly don’t take winning/losing seriously. It is a fun thing, I enter beers, my friends enter beers, we judge the beers, we see where the chips may fall, then we congratulate the winners, have a few a laughs and drink a few more beers. Good times, and we all become better brewers, judges and friends as a result.
Our club “gently” encourages members to enter comps, but we respect those that do not, and comps are certainly not the focus of our club. I have probably won more than my fair share of medals, but I get most excited when a new member wins something, I’m usually the first to congratulate them and ask them more about the beer they brewed.
I am not painting you with the same brush as some people I know, but I do know some people that frankly can’t handle comps. They take it too serious; they rub it in when they win, strut around showing off their medals, but then call shenanigans when they lose. We used to have several of these types in our club, and fortunately they have all dropped out. I ran into one of them recently, and they flat out told me they could never go back because their personality is just too competitive.
Denny, you asked me what is too much when it comes to money being spent on competitions, That implies that money is spent. So, I’ll ask you again, how much is spent on competitions?
Apparently, you do actually have quite a competitive spirit with this question over and over.
Like markaberrant before you, I too have lot’s of competitive friends. Most of the ones who are disgruntled against comps had a very LONG loosing streak.
Or they are like another friend of mine, who went ballistically haywire on a forum that I run for my club because the very first entry he ever made in his very first comp ever, didn’t even pass the first table, and he refused to actually believe someone out there was better. Tell ya what. I usually put in a max of two entries to a comp. I am not sad if I loose. But when I beat someone who put in 75, well, there is a certain gratification of course. But who cares really.
Does the NRA sponsor and participate in shooting event’s? If so, is that wrong?
I can see your point…if I were placed in the same situation I likely would grow tired of it as well…so no hard feelings from me regarding your attitude towards comps as your personal decision. And obviously, you can respect that others enjoy it and pursue it, as that is their personal choice.
So then, if I read you right, you’re really just wondering out loud why there is the appearance, at least in your eyes, that more homebrewers are focused on competitions alone as a pursuit. If true, then yes, that is disturbing…because there is more to homebrewing than winning competitions. I find it hard to imagine how someone would have competitions as their only focus…but maybe some do. Is this closer to what you’re getting at?
PS…I certainly meant no offense when I used the word “Haole,” I just have no qualms about using self-depreciating humor; if anything just to be clear that I’m no one special…just your run-of-the-mill homebrewer.
And I’m glad you’re here.
I entered a comp only once and then decided that it is aditional work and money I’m not willing to spend. However, I think that competitions are a great incentive for brewers to work on their process and recipes. Because the judging is done by people there is a subjective side to the results and in order to win on a regular basis it takes more than brewing a really great beer.
The AHA should be involved in competitions as long as this involvement is balanced with other activities.
I appreciate the effort AHA puts into competitions even though I don’t plan to enter one anytime soon (if ever). I like to read the stories, read the recipes, etc., and I consider the recipes that come out of these competitions to be a great insight into current interpretations of beer styles. As these recipes accrue, they become historical records of styles “back in the day,” as well as a snapshot of the evolving face of homebrewing.
So for me, to the question “how much time/resources does AHA put into competitions,” the response would be “just enough.” In addition, the AHA advocates for homebrewing, provides this forum, has an excellent magazine, and otherwise gives me a lot of bang for the cost of membership.
I don’t care about the dollar amount (not even as a percentage) because it wouldn’t make sense out of context of understanding the entire AHA budget, which would take more than numbers on a page.
I’m with you there kgs. I enjoy my AHA membership and consider it to have excellent value. Usually, within a day or two of my current issue of Zymurgy arriving I am inspired to fire the kettle. I really enjoy my interaction with other brewers via this forum too.
I hope that all understand my questioning the reasons people pursue beer competition is curiosity, and is certainly not meant as criticism of the BA or AHA.
Sorry if this has been said before, but I think competitions serve as an excellent learning tool. There’s nobody out here to sample my beer and tell me what I could be doing better, and I see that as being a function of competitions. You can, of course, have your local club do the same sorts of things with tastings, but with a competition you’re getting opinions from people who have been trained to know the styles and can identify exactly what the off flavors might be.
Sounds good, and that’s the way it’s supposed to work, but quite often it is not. Many times I had the exact same beer judged by 6 or 8 different judges and got 6 or 8 different opinions. Which is correct?
The reason: To win!! Can’t believe no one has said it yet. It’s not the reason I brew ( my midsection can attest to that ) but I don’t enter a competition just for feedback. Although that is invaluable too.
I voted “right amount of time and resources”. I am getting the impression from this thread that the poll question was an indirect way of probing why people enter competitions (and maybe would have been better posed that way). So I’ll address both.
Time and resources - I don’t see anything out of line here. It has been adequately explained by those in the know that the time and resources are relatively limited at the NHC. Lots of artisanal crafts have competitions - for example, cheesemaking, baking, farm animals, big pumpkin contests…it is not unusual for at least some segment of the people involved to want some way of measuring where their handle of the craft stands against others. So I have no problem with the AHA’s relatively limited application of resources toward the NHC. It sounds like in some cases, homebrew clubs put a lot of resources into competitions, but this should be separated from the AHA’s investment of resources.
Why are people interested? Speaking for myself I enter foremost to get feedback on how to improve my brewing and my process, and I have definitely succeeded here. Yes, some competitions have provided better feedback than others, but I have found more often than not the remarks from judges to be very thoughtful and in the spirit of helping me improve my brewing. I admit that I also have a competitive side, but to me any ribbons I have won are validation of research, experimentation, and work to improve and control my process.
If there are others like me who have these interests (and given the responses, I know at least the feedback part is shared by others who enter competitions), then what is the problem with devotion of a limited amount of resources, if it seems to be something that promotes (good) brewing at large?
It could be all are correct or at least some. I remember a beer I had I was entering, but hadn’t tasted in awhile got a slight acetadehyde comment at one comp, a moderate at the next and at a third a strong (one of the judges was the same as the first comp). I tasted it an quickly went to watering trees with the brew. So all were correct at any given time.
Sorry you have soured on comps in your area, perhaps you should move ;D
There is no right answer when it comes to judging beers. It’s a qualitative process, so of course feedback is going to differ. If you are looking for an absolute, then the only recourse I can offer is to submit your beer to whatever god you worship, if any. You may have to wait a while for feedback, however.
As for why people enter competitions? That’s like asking why people do anything at all. Everyone’s motivations are different. But in general, people tend to be competitive. Pretty much every hobby or activity I can think of has some sort of opportunity for competition. Some would argue it’s human nature. If the AHA didn’t offer to run a national competition, I’d bet they would be strongly pressured by the membership to do so.
I can respect that someone who has been brewing and competing for many years might get burnt out of competitions. I don’t think of myself as having a strongly competitive disposition. I am a new brewer, however, and am starting to enter competitions because I want feedback. I’m not expecting it to provide me anything other that another person’s (hopefully) objective perspective.
As for clubs: My club picks four styles a year randomly for informal competition. I wouldn’t say it’s the driving focus of our club at all. We have a diverse group and we have diverse activities. If you are not satisfied with how you club is run you are free to start your own club with a different set of goals.
Can’t believe no one has said it yet. It’s not the reason I brew ( my midsection can attest to that ) but I don’t enter a competition just for feedback. Although that is invaluable too.