Is cohumulone still a consideration? Years back, the theory was that it gave a harsher, rougher bitterness but I thought that had been disproven.
Personally I don’t think it is, but I don’t know if I’ve seen proof. My main point was that I think that there’s got to be a lot more at play than just iso-alpha acids, especially at the higher hop usage rates we’ve started seeing in the past 10 to 15 years.
i know of one DIPA i can get around here that has the absolute harshest bitterness i recall tasting. it’s flavour profile is decent, but i dumped the last third, last time i had it. i should ask them what hops they use. https://www.beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/194/99230/
A couple of gravity points aside, the original recipe basically fits an American Strong Ale as well. So maybe I should just change the name of the beer and call it a day! 
So coming full circle, does that original recipe/process get me something that has a malt presence but is also dry enough to be a bit more quaffable than a typical chewy Barleywine? I’d like to keep the ABV up and the bitterness up. And hopefully some hop aroma will stick around for at least 6 months or so.
And is it realistic to believe that I can coax 75% out of BRY-97? If not, what am I doing here? 
Chinook and Cascade per their website. Chinook can definitely put a nice firm bite on the bitterness.
Any bottle conditioning advice for this still to be brewed Barleywine?
My intention is to go straight from the fermenter to bottles, no priming bucket. My reasoning is that this will be less aggravation and less to clean, though I will have to sugar-prime all bottles individually. I also do not intend to add any additional yeasties to the bottles, hoping that after 2-3 weeks of primary, the original yeast will make a triumphant return to form. Red flags?
As I see it, measuring the correct amount of sugar to add per bottle will be my biggest hurdle. Or am I missing hurdles?
Do you have a spigot on your fermenter? I used to bottle out of primary for my 1 gallon batches using an autosiphon and bottling wand and it was such a pain in the ass. I’ll never do that again. It’s way easier to rack to a purged keg and use a little CO2 pressure to push the beer into bottles.
This ^^^
I rack to a keg with the appropriate amount of sugar. Then, I shove a bottling wand into a picnic tap and fill the bottles.
Yep, I have a spigot. From spigot to bottle, then cap it. One short piece of hose to sanitize, besides the bottles. Can’t see that taking very long. :
I haven’t bottled in ages and I guess I’m more wondering if there are any tricks to bottle carbing such a high gravity beer…
No tricks needed. I’ve bottle conditioned beers in the 12-14% range with no extra steps involved other than a little patience. The yeast might be a bit sluggish and could take an extra week or two to fully carb up.
If I was going to age an American barleywine for six months I’d go higher than 80 IBUs.
Me too! I aim for 100 IBUs or more because the bitterness can fade, but it helps level out the big malt flavor with another layer from the hops. I have also learned that an IBU can be a lie, anyway an American version should have a big hop presence.
Yes, I agree. I took Denny’s earlier advice about using the hops/bitterness as one way to balance the malt sweetness. I upped my calculated top-of-the-boil IBU’s to 100, not counting any IBU contributions from the late additions.
So, in order to balance the maltiness, I’ve got:
A water profile leaning heavily on SO4, thanks to a gypsum addition.
A 90 minute mash.
A low mash temp, say 147-148.
A bit of sugar.
And a bracing IBU level.
Still a few weeks away from brew day, adjustments can still be made.
I’ll be brewing this on Sunday so I’m currently navigating the obligatory “overthinking” stage of this new (to me) brew session.
I have kicked around many different ideas on how to handle this much grain for my BIAB mash. Lots of interesting mash concepts out there (back to back mashes, simultaneous mashes, etc.), but in the end I’ve decided to just stick with my normal, straight up, dunk and run. My only concern with this is lifting the bag and holding it until I get to my pre-boil volume. I think I have this covered though, I just haven’t told my 22 year old son yet.
My bigger concern is conversion though. Aside from crushing a bit finer and mashing a bit longer, any suggestions on how best to make off with the most sugars. My goal is 1.094 and I’d be ok with 1.084 even, but I’d like to be in the ballpark. I did lower my efficiency when designing the recipe so I hope to have some fudge factor already built in.
Thoughts?
Edit I don’t think sparging will be an option, and I don’t think it would help much anyway. Could be wrong about that though.
I think you will be fine. I usually get about 10 points lower on efficiency when I make big beers on my system. Not sure what you use for fermentation, but the fermentation can get very aggressive and heat up a bit. Good luck and let us know how it works out.
I know it’s a different approach and more English than American, but I brewed this Barleywine in January 2020. Recipe is essentially a clone of a recipe from Morticaixavier who used to post here frequently. It might be the best brew I’ve ever made in 8+ years of brewing.
Rough estimates are:
65Maris Otter
27% Munich II
7.7% sugar, table
IBUs are low at projected 57, with target OG of 1.104. Using 2 oz Magnum at 60; an ounce each of Saaz and Hallertau Mittelfrueh at 0 minutes.
Initial targets of:
OG: 1.104
IBU: 57
Color: 12.4 SRM
Target FG: 1.031
ABV: 10.9%
Fermented with WLP007(2 fresh vials)
Ran no sparge, capped mash with some medium crystal for an ordinary bitter fr second runnings. That small beer literally paled in comparison, and likely half the keg was dumped after 6 months(better options available)
Finished at:
OG: 1.105
FG: 1.018
ABV: 11.6%
To me, it’s the best big beer I’ve ever brewed. I’ve brewed Skotrats Traquair House clone, Denny and Drew’s queen of Diamonds, Palmer’s Fighting Urak Hai, various Pliny Clones, clones of an award winning local double nut brown, etc. It’s smooth, with an alcoholic warmth, not heat. Plenty of bitterness in the front side, but the malt really is the star.
May not be the sharp bitterness beast you’re looking for, but I may brew this beast every year from now on and I give all credit to Morticaixavier
Even now, 17 months after brew day, this brew shines on through. I don’t enter comps normally, but I would have entered this one if 2020 was a normal year and would have expected some strong scores. I bottled it up half and half in 12oz and 22oz bombers. The bombers are about all that is left right now and I expect will pour very nicely this upcoming winter
Thanks for that. While it’s too late for me to make any changes to the direction I’ve chosen, I will definitely keep this recipe for reference.
For the record, I enjoy a malt presence in a Barleywine. What I’m not so crazy about is when that malt presence buries the rest of the beer leading to a sweetness that - for me - doesn’t invite another sip. I realize this is all relative to the drinker, but my goal here is to dial it back some and balance that maltiness, not eliminate it. According to my predicted vitals, this beer still falls under “American Barleywine”, though admittedly, I’m pushing the hops.
I posted earlier that I upped the BTU’s to 100, but I think that was going too far. If I was making a 1.100 beer, then sure. But I’m shooting for mid 90’s (give or take a dozen or so ), so I’ve dropped the IBU’s back down to where I started, about 75-80 (BU:GU ≈ .8 ).
This is the slightly updated final recipe:
Batch Size - 2.5gal (into fermenter)
OG ≈ 1.095
FG ≈ 1.025
ABV ≈ 9 - 9.5
SRM ≈ 13 - 15 15-18
79% American 2-Row
11% 14% Dark Munich
8% 5% Corn Sugar
2% C120
80 IBU’s Chinook @60
1oz Idaho 7 @0
1oz Loral @0
2 packs BRY-97
Yeast nutrient in the boil
Mash - 90 minutes at 148°
Boil - 90 minutes
Bottle to ≈ 2.25 volumes.
So…on paper, I’m ok with that. But process is going to determine whether I can actually brew what’s in my head…A Barleywine that borrows a bit from an IIPA.
With a BIAB setup, you should be fine with your normal process. I’ve done a several beers above 1.100 on my system and I get predictable OGs. I double crush as my crusher gets fussy with a really tight gap on the first pass. I get more dough balls with fine crush and seems even worse wi Maris Otter (might be perception). I don’t find I need longer mash, but that is around 152 degrees.
What a day. Mashing in was a bit of an adventure, lots of work to bust up all of the dough balls. I was on my own with lifting that bag and trying to hit pre-boil and I thought I was going to die. A 1:30 mash and a near 1:45 boil. WTF? Whose idea was this? Definitely a once a year type of brew session. Nearly 6 hours when I’m usually done in 4-1/2 tops. But, in the end I hit 1.096. So I feel the process and recipe numbers have been vindicated somewhat. Still, I think my next beer will be a SMASH.
Yep, I’m down to just one big beer per year, maybe 2. A chewy Barleywine and a nice Scotch ale. The big boys really do take a lot more prep time, brew day time and patience on the back end