Boil Time?

[jeffy]

@hopfenundmalz

@kevin

@brewsumore

@kevin

@brewsumore

For me it depends partly on the beer style and final results I’m looking for, but in general at least 1 hour.  For beers where I’m looking for a slightly higher degree of wort caramelization (such as wee heavy, dark strong Belgian) it might be at least a 2-hour boil.

Wee Heavy was a single beer produced by Fowler’s in Scotland and not a style. Its proper name was Twelve Guinea Ale but referenced as a “wee” heavy in their advertising materials. It also needs to be pointed out that it is a myth that Scottish brewers used long boil times to caramelize the wort. Brewing records show that at times the Scots boil times were shorter than their London counterparts. At other times their boil schedules grew longer but overall Scottish boil times were no longer or shorter than any other brewery.

http://www.bjcp.org/style/2015/17/17C/wee-heavy/

Also, see https://www.traquair.co.uk/brewery/ and scroll down to “How the Beer is Brewed”  It shows a “2 hour boil.”  Admittedly, 2 hours is not necessarily long enough to caramelize the wort very much.

Time marches on.

Note that I did not say that wee heavy is not now a recognized style. I said it “was a single beer…” Past tense.

Traquair was and is a very small, provincial brewery. The fact remains that the written records of the major Scottish breweries show boil times of 60 to 120 minutes… most of the time. And in my original post I did said “at times” Scottish boil times were shorter. I also said that at other times they were longer.

If you want to boil your strong Scottish ale for 2 hours or more and call it wee heavy then by all means do so. Just recognize that there are some accepted practices when it comes to Scottish brewing that are pure myth.

Did you see Ron Pattinson’s talk at last year’s HomebrewCon? You are echoing what he said, without the F bombs.  8)

Maybe that’s why they put him in the basement.  ;D

[system]

I read that Pilsner Urquell employs a full 2 hour boil.

[denny]

Other than special circumstances, there is nothing to be gained by a longer boil.

[slowbrew]

@denny

Other than special circumstances, there is nothing to be gained by a longer boil.

I guess I’m doing an experiment on this now.  I misread my recipe for a dunkleweis(sp?) yesterday where it called for a 90 minute boil.  I did a 60 minute.  Seemed to turn out okay so far. 

Paul

[denny]

@slowbrew

@denny

Other than special circumstances, there is nothing to be gained by a longer boil.

I guess I’m doing an experiment on this now.  I misread my recipe for a dunkleweis(sp?) yesterday where it called for a 90 minute boil.  I did a 60 minute.  Seemed to turn out okay so far. 

Paul

I did an 8 hour boil for a bier de garde…that made a difference in flavor.  But between 60 and 90 min. I think you’ll be hard pressed to tell the difference.

[Visor]

@denny

@slowbrew

@denny

Other than special circumstances, there is nothing to be gained by a longer boil.

I guess I’m doing an experiment on this now.  I misread my recipe for a dunkleweis(sp?) yesterday where it called for a 90 minute boil.  I did a 60 minute.  Seemed to turn out okay so far. 

Paul

I did an 8 hour boil for a bier de garde…that made a difference in flavor.  But between 60 and 90 min. I think you’ll be hard pressed to tell the difference.

….other than a slightly higher O.G. and some additional caramelization that most of us wouldn’t be able to detect in a blind taste test.

[denny]

@Visor

@denny

@slowbrew

@denny

Other than special circumstances, there is nothing to be gained by a longer boil.

I guess I’m doing an experiment on this now.  I misread my recipe for a dunkleweis(sp?) yesterday where it called for a 90 minute boil.  I did a 60 minute.  Seemed to turn out okay so far. 

Paul

I did an 8 hour boil for a bier de garde…that made a difference in flavor.  But between 60 and 90 min. I think you’ll be hard pressed to tell the difference.

….other than a slightly higher O.G. and some additional caramelization that most of us wouldn’t be able to detect in a blind taste test.

Maillard reactions, not caramelization

[fredthecat]

@trapae

Mash/boil-60/60 min for ales.
Just did my first lager and did 60/90.

Incidentally, my ocd science brain is really stressed out by all ya’all not measuring og, fg etc…
It’s part of the fun/process of the whole thing.  My buddy who is an engineer, doesn’t measure either.  He just makes everything “work” the easiest way possible.  Doesn’t care about perfection.  Must not have any German DNA. 

this is why i’ve kept to myself about my homebrewing so much.

i used to try to get other people involved, but they just didn’t get the joy in the exact details of it all. i’ve stopped bothering with how most people do their things because of much i cringe when i see them wing it.

[system]

@fredthecat

@trapae

Mash/boil-60/60 min for ales.
Just did my first lager and did 60/90.

Incidentally, my ocd science brain is really stressed out by all ya’all not measuring og, fg etc…
It’s part of the fun/process of the whole thing.  My buddy who is an engineer, doesn’t measure either.  He just makes everything “work” the easiest way possible.  Doesn’t care about perfection.  Must not have any German DNA. 

this is why i’ve kept to myself about my homebrewing so much.

i used to try to get other people involved, but they just didn’t get the joy in the exact details of it all. i’ve stopped bothering with how most people do their things because of much i cringe when i see them wing it.

Started out with 1 hour boils. Then a pro brewer told me to use a 2 hour boil.
No…never kept track of any specific readings, other than a detailed brewing log of times / temps / etc.

Got 1st Place for my APA at the North Texas State Fair Brewing Competition. My scores at the Bluebonnet in Dallas (Czech Lager) ranged from 35-37 points from the judges. Brewed this Czech Pils after touring the brewery in Pilzn. The judges comments were quite positive.

My career is in a field that is highly detailed, with lots of recurrent training and studying. I brew for fun, not to become a scientist! But for those who are into those sort of micro measurements, go for it!

[fredthecat]

sure, i was just replying to that particular person.

i know people brew for very different reasons including myself. the main reason i keep detailed notes (which have become less  unnecessarily detailed since when i started) is so that if i make something good i can recreate it, or if something is wrong i can try to pinpoint it and remove it from future brews.

[system]

@fredthecat

sure, i was just replying to that particular person.

i know people brew for very different reasons including myself. the main reason i keep detailed notes (which have become less  unnecessarily detailed since when i started) is so that if i make something good i can recreate it, or if something is wrong i can try to pinpoint it and remove it from future brews.

And therein lies the secret to repetition. Just like the big brewers have a staff of scientists on their payroll to ensure that the next keg of (your favorite beer) tastes exactly like the last keg.
While my beers were always pretty good, exactly replicating any one beer was challenging.

[brewsumore]

@kevin

@brewsumore

@kevin

@brewsumore

For me it depends partly on the beer style and final results I’m looking for, but in general at least 1 hour.  For beers where I’m looking for a slightly higher degree of wort caramelization (such as wee heavy, dark strong Belgian) it might be at least a 2-hour boil.

Wee Heavy was a single beer produced by Fowler’s in Scotland and not a style. Its proper name was Twelve Guinea Ale but referenced as a “wee” heavy in their advertising materials. It also needs to be pointed out that it is a myth that Scottish brewers used long boil times to caramelize the wort. Brewing records show that at times the Scots boil times were shorter than their London counterparts. At other times their boil schedules grew longer but overall Scottish boil times were no longer or shorter than any other brewery.

http://www.bjcp.org/style/2015/17/17C/wee-heavy/

Also, see https://www.traquair.co.uk/brewery/ and scroll down to “How the Beer is Brewed”  It shows a “2 hour boil.”  Admittedly, 2 hours is not necessarily long enough to caramelize the wort very much.

Time marches on.

Note that I did not say that wee heavy is not now a recognized style. I said it “was a single beer…” Past tense.

Traquair was and is a very small, provincial brewery. The fact remains that the written records of the major Scottish breweries show boil times of 60 to 120 minutes… most of the time. And in my original post I did said “at times” Scottish boil times were shorter. I also said that at other times they were longer.

If you want to boil your strong Scottish ale for 2 hours or more and call it wee heavy then by all means do so. Just recognize that there are some accepted practices when it comes to Scottish brewing that are pure myth.

Gotcha.  Thanks Kevin.  I misread that.  Interesting history - thanks for sharing it!

And, most certainly, those of us who brew the Skotrat Traquair House Ale clone, or similar recipe, boil down a lot of mash runoff into a little syrup and re-add to the kettle, so caramelization by boiling down is a huge part of that.  And whether or not it’s traditional to Scottish brewing methods, it makes a rich, satisfying, wonderful wee heavy.

[ynotbrusum]

That reduction process is well documented.  I have done it with success, but I have judged competitions where entrants scorched the reduction to a point where the entry was not pleasant to drink.  I rarely go that route due to the extra effort, but it can produce an outstanding Wee Heavy, for sure.