The “malty sweet aroma, and bready mouthfeel” is what got this quibble over “terminology” started. Rather a group of common adjectives used to describe flavors. It is like arguing with my wife over verb tense, or “You and I” instead of “Me and You” at any point. I doubt there to be an “issue” rather than a need to quibble over opinions and impressions some people think of when they drink a beer and what I think of. I disagree that the impression of “bready mouthfeel” relating to only Big Stout, Barleywine, or High Gravity beers or scotch ale. The breadlike impression doesn’t stop at dark big beers. And reserving an opinion and changing how to describe it based on what style you are drinking? why would you? Wouldn’t that be like saying you are drinking a beer that you read about over the internet? Only describing it as others have described it? Blind taste test - see what you really get out of beer, be open and honest, and get that pompus puffery of Sommeliers out of your system and drink a beer.
a lot of us in the conversation are BJCP (certified, with national level tasting scores here) of one level or another. We aren’t trying to invalidate your experience or opinion. However you offered advice on a recipe that doesn’t jive at all with my experience with the style. We are discussing politely as is the habit of folks here on this forum. My comments were intended to feel out if the difference we were experiencing had to do with different understandings of the terms. Another option is that the examples you have tasted are a bit oxidized which can lead to a more sweet seeming character do to honey like oxidation products.
From the 2015 BJCP guidelines on flavor “Attenuation is extremely high, which gives a characteristic dry finish essential to the style; a Saison should never finish sweet”
I personally like all my beers to have a citrusy, fruity, spicy, earthy aroma with hints of peppercorn spice, nutmeg and cinnamon notes and a mild Chardonnay, muscato, hard cider alcohol smell. Flavor wise I really dig a peppery, spicy phenolic and fruity estery flavor with definite bready, toasty, roasty, tollhouse chocolate chip and oatmeal cookie tones along with pear, apple, grapefruit, banana and anise tastes. Personally when it comes to mouthfeel I like it chewy like a soft, fresh baked loaf of sourdough bread with a creamy, buttery, brown sugary, sweet and dry white and red wine aftertaste that hits your tongue with a bitter, dry, bubbly and effervescent affect.
I’m joking of course.
Agreed with Jonathan. I’m neither a sommelier nor a snob. We were just trying to sort through terms to see if that’s where some of the differences in perception might lie. Last thing I’m trying to do is tell somebody they didn’t perceive what they perceived.
This is one of the most important aspects, IMO, for a saison to be a saison. Perception of mouthfeel, different flavors or levels of spice, etc - I’m fine with all of that, but if a saison has any perception of sweetness to it I think it’s missing the mark.