First go round at a saison as my last attempt didn’t have the proper yeast and turned out to be closer to a wit. Kind of going for a kitchen sink type thing here with a couple of questions.
First, will the hops clash with the lemon and basil additions? Should I scale the finishing hops back or remove them all together? I wanted to do something more hop forward but figured I shouldn’t go too hoppy with the basil and lemon…
Second, can I expect 90% or greater attenuation from Belle Saison? What mash temp should I use? Should I add any sugar?
Lastly, do I need to even worry about color? This is calculated to be super light at around 3.7 SRM
Saison is a pretty wide open style so you’ll get lots of different answers. Don’t worry about it being too light - saisons are all over the map in terms of color (and flavor). Mine is light, too. But it needs to be highly attenuated, and Belle will get you there. Mashing @ 147-148F/ 90 mins will get it down to the 1.004-1.002 range or slightly lower, but Belle will leave a nice mouthfeel. As for the hops, it’s personal preference. I wouldn’t go too heavy with late hops given the lemon and basil additions. But if it sounds good, go for it.
As rare as it might be, I prefer 3711 against 3724 in saisons I have tasted and don’t want to worry about the dreaded stall. I really like 3711 and heard that Belle is similar. I have had a packet in the fridge for quite a while that needs to be used.
I think your recipe is great, the ingredients will not clash but should work well.
Belle Saison yeast has about 96% apparent attenuation. I think your final gravity will probably be about 1.002, and that’s without any added sugar. Add a half pound or pound of sugar if you like and it could fall to 1.000 or anywhere in those ballparks.
Key thing to note, though: Belle/3711 is a trickster yeast. You’ll think it’s done fermenting after a week or whatever, but it’s not. Let it sit for an entire month if you want low gravity. It will keep on chugging very very very slooooooowly over the course of three more weeks.
Maybe, but they might have different properties. I didn’t like my results with Belle. I know some folks prefer 1056 over 001 over US05 over what ever other Chico strains are out there.
I’m curious if you gave it enough time. Takes a whole month, even fermented in the mid-70s or hotter. I start mine in the upper 60s then bring to about 75-76 F for a whole month. Finishes rock bottom around 1.002 or whatever.
As for flavor, I love it. It is mild but characterful, a little peppery spice and a little lemony.
You are correct. Accept all of the above with grains of salt. Yeasts from different manufacturers are all slightly different, even from the same original sources. I totally agree.
Went three weeks which leads me even further to believe that it isn’t the same as 3711 when I can get something in the keg in <14 days, even when pitching a little low. I typically start at 68 and let it free rise to 74
Edit to add - it was at 1.008 for 8 days before I kegged.
Oh… good data. I hadn’t heard of these kinds of differences previously but will keep on the lookout for more such data. I love dry yeasts so I’m sure I’m biased as well.
FWIW, I’ve used 3724 in three separate saisons now. First finished at about 95% AA, pure 3724 and warm temps. The second I pitched 3711 later in the fermentation to ensure the high ABV of this beer didn’t slow down the 3724, I wanted this beer to finish quickly. Third I stalled on purpose to inoculate with Orval dregs.
It’s a tricky yeast, but it’s certainly not an impossible or painful yeast. Pitch a healthy starter, cover the fermentor with foil for the first few days, then airlock and ramp temps up. It’s like the opposite of a lager.
Take all this with a grain of salt though, I do not like 3711. As in I no longer buy craft Saison’s because I don’t know if they used 3711 or not.
I’m hoping I get the time to make a quick all pils malt 4% abv-ish saison before the summer is out.
I’m also getting bored with 3711 and will be looking to maintain some sort of blend at some point. Want to try the Imperial Rustic strain, but MoreBeer isn’t restocking and I don’t know if I can put a large enough order with Seven Bridges to justify the shipping. Also thinking about taking all of yeastbay’s clean strains and dumping it into one batch.