Introduction to Low Oxygen Brewing

[bayareabrewer]

@beersk

@bayareabrewer

used c20 and not carahell, since I didn’t have that on hand.

Don’t suppose it’s for everyone. It’s been said from the beginning - if you like the way you’re brewing now, no need to change. I can understand how you feel about people feeling it’s superior. For many beer styles? Maybe not “superior”. For German lagers? Prooooobably superior. Because that’s how they’re brewed nowadays and if you want that certain flavor profile, that’s how you get it.

I’m always looking to improve, I just didn’t taste too much of a difference, certainly not a game changer. And I think you said it best, “flavor profile”.

[system]

@Philbrew

I recall reading posts in the various LODO threads that high DO in wort can oxidize the flavor compounds we are trying to protect in a matter of minutes.  Can that happen at various fermentation temps?  Ales at 66-68F.  Lagers at 46-52F.

Absolutely, thats why you want to pitch healthy active yeast and minimize lag.

[beersk]

@bayareabrewer

@beersk

@bayareabrewer

used c20 and not carahell, since I didn’t have that on hand.

Don’t suppose it’s for everyone. It’s been said from the beginning - if you like the way you’re brewing now, no need to change. I can understand how you feel about people feeling it’s superior. For many beer styles? Maybe not “superior”. For German lagers? Prooooobably superior. Because that’s how they’re brewed nowadays and if you want that certain flavor profile, that’s how you get it.

I’m always looking to improve, I just didn’t taste too much of a difference, certainly not a game changer. And I think you said it best, “flavor profile”.

I think it does make for fresher and brighter tasting beer though. And it really makes me wonder what many beers of the world would taste like if brewed this way. I don’t know if a wort sample test is really going to change your mind, I know it has many people’s minds, but for me, I really needed to brew and drink the finished beer. But I took babysteps to get where I am in low oxygen, so it wasn’t an all-at-once sorta deal where my mind could be blown.

[skatz (Stevie)]

I enjoy the brulosophy experiments, but I find at times the experiment designs are lacking.

[beersk]

I enjoy the brulosophy experiments, but I find at times the experiment designs are lacking.

Well, judging by the fact that Marshall doesn’t post here anymore, I kinda think he got that impression from a lot of people.

[bayareabrewer]

@beersk

@bayareabrewer

@beersk

@bayareabrewer

used c20 and not carahell, since I didn’t have that on hand.

Don’t suppose it’s for everyone. It’s been said from the beginning - if you like the way you’re brewing now, no need to change. I can understand how you feel about people feeling it’s superior. For many beer styles? Maybe not “superior”. For German lagers? Prooooobably superior. Because that’s how they’re brewed nowadays and if you want that certain flavor profile, that’s how you get it.

I’m always looking to improve, I just didn’t taste too much of a difference, certainly not a game changer. And I think you said it best, “flavor profile”.

I think it does make for fresher and brighter tasting beer though. And it really makes me wonder what many beers of the world would taste like if brewed this way. I don’t know if a wort sample test is really going to change your mind, I know it has many people’s minds, but for me, I really needed to brew and drink the finished beer. But I took babysteps to get where I am in low oxygen, so it wasn’t an all-at-once sorta deal where my mind could be blown.

that’s cool man, to each their own. For me, the little experiment didn’t warrant changing my procedures.

[narcout]

@beersk

I enjoy the brulosophy experiments, but I find at times the experiment designs are lacking.

Well, judging by the fact that Marshall doesn’t post here anymore, I kinda think he got that impression from a lot of people.

They often have discussions with posters regarding the design of a particular experiment on Reddit.  The Monday experiment results posts on r/homebrewing often have at least 100 comments.

[system]

@narcout

@beersk

I enjoy the brulosophy experiments, but I find at times the experiment designs are lacking.

Well, judging by the fact that Marshall doesn’t post here anymore, I kinda think he got that impression from a lot of people.

They often have discussions with posters regarding the design of a particular experiment on Reddit.  The Monday experiment results posts on r/homebrewing often have at least 100 comments.

Reddit… ugg. Its the SJW’s of the internet world.

[beersk]

@narcout

@beersk

I enjoy the brulosophy experiments, but I find at times the experiment designs are lacking.

Well, judging by the fact that Marshall doesn’t post here anymore, I kinda think he got that impression from a lot of people.

They often have discussions with posters regarding the design of a particular experiment on Reddit.  The Monday experiment results posts on r/homebrewing often have at least 100 comments.

Ah, I see. They’ve found their niche on Reddit.

[Philbrew]

@Philbrew

I recall reading posts in the various LODO threads that high DO in wort can oxidize the flavor compounds we are trying to protect in a matter of minutes.  Can that happen at various fermentation temps?  Ales at 66-68F.  Lagers at 46-52F.

Absolutely, thats why you want to pitch healthy active yeast and minimize lag.

So, how fast does the yeast scavenge all the O2?

[system]

@Philbrew

@Philbrew

I recall reading posts in the various LODO threads that high DO in wort can oxidize the flavor compounds we are trying to protect in a matter of minutes.  Can that happen at various fermentation temps?  Ales at 66-68F.  Lagers at 46-52F.

Absolutely, thats why you want to pitch healthy active yeast and minimize lag.

So, how fast does the yeast scavenge all the O2?

Usually within 1-2 hrs, if healthy and active.

[homoeccentricus]

@narcout

@beersk

I enjoy the brulosophy experiments, but I find at times the experiment designs are lacking.

Well, judging by the fact that Marshall doesn’t post here anymore, I kinda think he got that impression from a lot of people.

They often have discussions with posters regarding the design of a particular experiment on Reddit.  The Monday experiment results posts on r/homebrewing often have at least 100 comments.

Reddit… ugg. Its the SJW’s of the internet world.

Had to look up that abbreviation. Not nice.

[bayareabrewer]

@narcout

@beersk

I enjoy the brulosophy experiments, but I find at times the experiment designs are lacking.

Well, judging by the fact that Marshall doesn’t post here anymore, I kinda think he got that impression from a lot of people.

They often have discussions with posters regarding the design of a particular experiment on Reddit.  The Monday experiment results posts on r/homebrewing often have at least 100 comments.

Reddit… ugg. Its the SJW’s of the internet world.

sjw?

[Philbrew]

@Philbrew

@Philbrew

I recall reading posts in the various LODO threads that high DO in wort can oxidize the flavor compounds we are trying to protect in a matter of minutes.  Can that happen at various fermentation temps?  Ales at 66-68F.  Lagers at 46-52F.

Absolutely, thats why you want to pitch healthy active yeast and minimize lag.

So, how fast does the yeast scavenge all the O2?

Usually within 1-2 hrs, if healthy and active.

There is a point in brewing (aeration after yeast pitch) where we go from low DO to high DO.  Then commences a race between the O2 oxidation and yeast O2 scavenging.  If it’s “minutes” vs “1-2 hrs”, the yeast loses the race.  No?

[beersk]

@bayareabrewer

@narcout

@beersk

I enjoy the brulosophy experiments, but I find at times the experiment designs are lacking.

Well, judging by the fact that Marshall doesn’t post here anymore, I kinda think he got that impression from a lot of people.

They often have discussions with posters regarding the design of a particular experiment on Reddit.  The Monday experiment results posts on r/homebrewing often have at least 100 comments.

Reddit… ugg. Its the SJW’s of the internet world.

sjw?

Social Justice Warrior from what I gather.

[bayareabrewer]

@beersk

@bayareabrewer

@narcout

@beersk

I enjoy the brulosophy experiments, but I find at times the experiment designs are lacking.

Well, judging by the fact that Marshall doesn’t post here anymore, I kinda think he got that impression from a lot of people.

They often have discussions with posters regarding the design of a particular experiment on Reddit.  The Monday experiment results posts on r/homebrewing often have at least 100 comments.

Reddit… ugg. Its the SJW’s of the internet world.

sjw?

Social Justice Warrior from what I gather.

something to do with homebrewing?

[skatz (Stevie)]

@bayareabrewer

@narcout

@beersk

I enjoy the brulosophy experiments, but I find at times the experiment designs are lacking.

Well, judging by the fact that Marshall doesn’t post here anymore, I kinda think he got that impression from a lot of people.

They often have discussions with posters regarding the design of a particular experiment on Reddit.  The Monday experiment results posts on r/homebrewing often have at least 100 comments.

Reddit… ugg. Its the SJW’s of the internet world.

sjw?

Silicone Jacketed Wire. It’s more reliable than plastic.

[system]

@Philbrew

@Philbrew

@Philbrew

I recall reading posts in the various LODO threads that high DO in wort can oxidize the flavor compounds we are trying to protect in a matter of minutes.  Can that happen at various fermentation temps?  Ales at 66-68F.  Lagers at 46-52F.

Absolutely, thats why you want to pitch healthy active yeast and minimize lag.

So, how fast does the yeast scavenge all the O2?

Usually within 1-2 hrs, if healthy and active.

There is a point in brewing (aeration after yeast pitch) where we go from low DO to high DO.  Then commences a race between the O2 oxidation and yeast O2 scavenging.  If it’s “minutes” vs “1-2 hrs”, the yeast loses the race.  No?

Its only minutes at mash temperatures, oxidation reactions slow with temperature.

But great questions.

[Philbrew]

@Philbrew

@Philbrew

@Philbrew

I recall reading posts in the various LODO threads that high DO in wort can oxidize the flavor compounds we are trying to protect in a matter of minutes.  Can that happen at various fermentation temps?  Ales at 66-68F.  Lagers at 46-52F.

Absolutely, thats why you want to pitch healthy active yeast and minimize lag.

So, how fast does the yeast scavenge all the O2?

Usually within 1-2 hrs, if healthy and active.

There is a point in brewing (aeration after yeast pitch) where we go from low DO to high DO.  Then commences a race between the O2 oxidation and yeast O2 scavenging.  If it’s “minutes” vs “1-2 hrs”, the yeast loses the race.  No?

Its only minutes at mash temperatures, oxidation reactions slow with temperature.

But great questions.

After re-reading your web page on yeast I’m beginning to understand how you are dealing with that critical aeration-after-yeast-pitch O2 oxidation/scavenging race.

1.  Pitch 50% more yeast cells than called for by calculators.

2.  Pitch active (not dormant) yeast.

3.  Pitch healthy but O2-hungry yeast.  Yeast that has depleted most of its reserves of the stuff that it needs  O2 for.  That may be why dry yeast doesn’t work well for LODO.  I’ve read that dry yeast comes out of the packet not needing O2.  Though I suppose one could try pitching dry yeast and not aerating.

[system]

@Philbrew

@Philbrew

@Philbrew

@Philbrew

I recall reading posts in the various LODO threads that high DO in wort can oxidize the flavor compounds we are trying to protect in a matter of minutes.  Can that happen at various fermentation temps?  Ales at 66-68F.  Lagers at 46-52F.

Absolutely, thats why you want to pitch healthy active yeast and minimize lag.

So, how fast does the yeast scavenge all the O2?

Usually within 1-2 hrs, if healthy and active.

There is a point in brewing (aeration after yeast pitch) where we go from low DO to high DO.  Then commences a race between the O2 oxidation and yeast O2 scavenging.  If it’s “minutes” vs “1-2 hrs”, the yeast loses the race.  No?

Its only minutes at mash temperatures, oxidation reactions slow with temperature.

But great questions.

After re-reading your web page on yeast I’m beginning to understand how you are dealing with that critical aeration-after-yeast-pitch O2 oxidation/scavenging race.

1.  Pitch 50% more yeast cells than called for by calculators.

2.  Pitch active (not dormant) yeast.

3.  Pitch healthy but O2-hungry yeast.  Yeast that has depleted most of its reserves of the stuff that it needs  O2 for.  That may be why dry yeast doesn’t work well for LODO.  I’ve read that dry yeast comes out of the packet not needing O2.  Though I suppose one could try pitching dry yeast and not aerating.

1. for Cold lager fermentations(the only ones we recommend), Absolutely. Ales standard pitching rates apply.

2. Yes, although I have great luck with my method.

3.Yup, exactly. Tried dry yeasts with and without oxygenating. I could get activity in sufficient time, but flavor and characteristics were not desirable.