Sometimes I wonder how off pH really has to be to mess up conversion. I feel that if you mix some hot water with crushed grains, you will pretty much get some sugary wort.
Untreated water pH for the average grist tends to settle at 5.8, treated water pH for optimal conversion is 5.2. (Textbook of Brewing Vol. 1)
The reason to adjust mash water pH is to optimize each stage of the mash (each temperature range has an optimal pH).
The reason to adjust the start of boil pH is to optimize hop oil isomerization.
The reason to adjust the end of boil pH is to end up at the proper pH after fermentation according to the acidity the yeast contributes
Most homebrewers only concern themselves with the mash pH as that’s what they’ve been taught and that’s the first one in the chain and if that’s correct then the rest often times fall reasonably into place. IMHO the mash pH could often be ignored as long as the end of boil pH is correct the beer will taste good.
Thanks…
AFAIK. It’s uploaded to the below link if you care to kill some time!
I used that much CaCl2 to get to the 150ppm mark.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/owxpuiz7s4pl1fu/jrm111%40gmail.com42161_6.xlsx?dl=0
Trent, since you’re new here to the forums…give us some background on your brewing history. I’m curious to know your background given your comments on the PH jazz.
I sat in a presentation by a pro back around 2010. He had a graph showing conversion eff. vs pH. It started around 5.2 for the X axis, was pretty flat to 5.6 to 5.8 ish, started to go down to 6.0, then fell off rapidly. I don’t know the trend below 5.2, but there will be a point the enzymes won’t be optimum.
Remember the congress mash is done with distilled water, so 5.8 is what that should happen at with Light base malt, and we compare our eff. to the results from a Congess mash.
Maybe I should do a mini-mash with my tap water and Pils malt, and see where the pH ends up (high) and how much eff I get.
It appears that you left out a bit of information. The statement above is most applicable if the untreated water starts out with low or no alkalinity. The result of mashing a relatively pale grist with alkaline water is likely to be a higher wort pH.
While I generally agree that you MIGHT be able to ignore mashing pH and make sure the kettle wort pH is in the proper range, there are plenty of waters and grists that would make that approach undesirable. I find that getting the mashing pH and sparging water alkalinity in the right range from the start, is a better approach to brewing.
I’d venture to guess the majority of all-grain homebrewers don’t adjust their water. These people make beers for years with their water and don’t know the difference. As with most processes in homebrew, try it for yourself and do what works for you.
5.8 also depends on the makeup of the grist not just the alkalinity of the water, a highly acidic grist will also settle moderately alkaline water at around that pH.
Pretty sure Mr. Brungard knows that, and you’re correct.
I’m of the opinion that for conversion, mash ph doesn’t really matter that much, you’ll get astringency before you have a noticeable impact on the conversion rate. I haven’t seen evidence otherwise.
This. Plus, I remember an old thread from the brewing network where one of the guys decided to try a mash without even crushing any of the grains whatsoever. It took a bit longer, but he was able to make wort with a fairly decent gravity (lower than crushed obviously).
I’ve witnessed this in person at one of my old clubs. I think he got about 40% efficiency on a planned 1.060 beer.
To OP, did you calibrate your ph meter before the brew?
Nah your beer will be fine. Don’t sweat it. I think you may have overshot your acid addition a bit, and as long as your beer doesn’t taste minerally you didn’t add too much calcium.
Conversion does suffer outside of a range but the range is quite wide, something like 4.7-5.8 or so. I know commercial and home brewers that intentionally mash at sub-5 ph on very light beers to obtain a crisp, just-short-of-tart finish to their beers.
Essentially the important figure which I don’t recall you had there is the mash ph in the first 15-20 minutes after dough-in. This is where a vast majority of the conversion of starches occurs and the most vital time when ph must be at the desired range. Remember also that ph is changing pretty steadily during the mash. The purpose of the calculators like bru’n water is to help determine the mash ph during that key 30 minute time frame at the beginning of the mash. The ph will dive during this first 15 mins then start to stabilize and even rise slightly by the end of the mash, before the sparge.
As a general rule ph values can fluctuate by up to .1 just from instrument error. Add to that most of us are not taking ph readings at the exact same time in our mash nor at the same temperature across batches. So some variance can occur there. Really the only reason to take ph readings of preboil and post boil beer is to have an additional set of data points to identify trends when something begins to be out of whack. That’s pro territory there though.
Again your beer will probably turn out just fine. If recommend calibrating your ph meter before each brewday, taking samples at the same time during the mash, and cooling them to 70-80F before measurement. If you are consistent in this, your ph readings will be way more useful for mash and water chemistry purposes.
Happy brewing!