Ok. I have over searched the internet and probably more confused than before I started. I am looking for a ro system primarily for home brewing. Of course it will be used in the home as well.
I looked at APEC, Spectrapure, Express Water, US Water Systems, Hahn Filtration from Costco which has a remineralzation feature which I don’t believe I want for brewing?
I live in town with municipal water, which I soften, not sure of incoming pressure (I will be calling the Water Dept tomorrow for this info). I would rather not use a pump if I can’t do without it. Prices range from $150-300.
I’ve been thinking about this option as well. Currently using RO water from a couple of stores in town. I check the machines with my TDS meter before buying. Sometimes they’re good, sometimes I have to wait a week or so for them to service the machines. I’ll be interested in what the forum has to say.
I always use RO water for brewing. The only downside is the small (4 gallon?) pressure tank. So I just set an alarm to go off every 40 minutes and I take another gallon out to the HLT. I have a Culligan system. I heartily recommend Bru’n Water software.
I would recommend a system from Air, Water, Ice.
I have a Typhoon III 150 gpd system & love it.
(The deionization portion is not necessary & rarely gets used.)
I bought a 30 gallon bladder tank on another site (actually holds 18 gallons) & ran a line to my kitchen, to supply drinking water.
If your municipal water pressure is typical, you won’t need a pump to pressurize the feed water.
Don’t worry too much about the brand of the system. They all use nearly the same components. The important factors are: system uses 10" filter cartridges and not the little bullet filters, system has a carbon block filter in one of the cartridges, system uses a quality membrane such as Dow Filmtec.
Discharging into an open container improves your system efficiency, but that may not be desirable if you want to deliver the water to taps. Get a big pressure tank if you don’t discharge to an open container. If your typical brew day requires X gallons of RO water, you will need a pressure tank with double that capacity.
What exactly do you mean by discharging to an open container? Wouldn’t any discharge go down the drain pipe? I was thinking of putting the RO system in the basement and running two lines for the ice maker and drinking tap. Is that feasible? Would I need a pump then? My thought was space under the sink is already being used, but it’s not like all the crap can’t be moved out.
Product water, not waste water. I was referring to discharge to a tank that is not pressurized.
I have also piped my RO system to both a kitchen tap and the ice maker like you want to do. You will have to discharge your RO product water to a pressurized tank in this case.
Check out the Kickstarter for HbrewO Systems. It’s an RO System designed for Homebrewers.
The website to the company is HbrewO.com
It’s an easy and precise approach to water treatment.
Hope it helps! Cheers!
Not trying to be a jerk, but it seems as if you have involvement in the product. If you do, awesome. Just say so.
That said. I’m interested. Would be great for apartment dwellers.
I’m curious as to how much waste water is produced. I know typical home systems can vary from 4-8 gallons wasted per gallon produced.
Edit.- I just did math and this would pay for itself in about 60 batches at $0.40/gallon RO. considering I am moving to a third floor apartment without an elevator, this is very attractive.
Here’s what I’m running. It’s designed for aquarium use, but has been working just fine for brewing.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00DOG64FM?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o04_s00
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00DSP57BQ?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o05_s00
I don’t have a pressurized storage tank, everything is plumbed to this air-gap faucet. Drain line runs via the air gap straight to the drain line.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0018MVYOK?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o08_s00
When collecting water for brew day, I slip a hose over the faucet and run that into a bucket. I use it for ice, but then only in regular ice trays/molds. I also installed a decent on/off valve on the main input for the RO system, as I don’t want it wasting water when not in use. (The regular icemaker “tap” valves take too long to throw all the way on to all off.)
This may not work for OP’s requirements, but I think it’s a good option for a lot of brewers.
Don’t forget an RO meter as well.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002C0A7ZY?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o06_s00
Wow. Here I figured the mounting frame was something they created. Thanks
FWIW I think it may be on sale, I think I paid ~$80 for the 100-gallon system when I bought mine. I know it was more than the 50-gallon setup.
That is a nice, neat system. However, it has some major flaws. First and most important, is that they are supplying a 100gpd membrane through a teeny carbon filter. That filter is not likely to consistently remove chloramine from the water supply and that will end up prematurely destroying the membrane. That filter may not even be able to consistently remove chlorine either, but its got a better chance of that. You really have to have a 10" or 20" carbon block filter to remove these contaminants when the RO production is 100 gpd.
The second flaw is the inclusion of a teeny DI filter. In the realm of brewing water, the difference between 2 ppm TDS and 20 ppm TDS is insignificant. The DI stage is wasted money for brewing use. The good thing is that it will be exhausted in short order and as long as you don’t waste your money replacing it after its exhausted.
Buyer beware.
Martin, which one are you talking about? The ‘Aquatic Life’ one or the RO in a briefcase one?
Martin, the aquarium system I posted is a 100 gallon per day system, not per hour. How does that change things?
So far it’s been working fine, still getting single-digit TDS after about 50 gallons of water.
This system was my quick hack to try and get a decent baseline water for brewing. I’m curious what I’ve done wrong/how I can improve things.
Good catch, Phil. My bad, I’m used to units like gpm in my day job. I’ve revised my post to read gpd, as intended.
With regard to Phil’s system. It’s virtually the same with the teeny filters. A system with the larger under-sink, 10" or 20" filters provides a longer residence time in the carbon and that significantly improves the reliability and completeness of chlorine-compound removal. Don’t skimp there or you will be replacing your membrane and the carbon filter way more often than you would normally have to. There is a nice write up about what to look for when buying a RO system on the Bru’n Water Facebook page.
Would adding an additional carbon filter where the sediment filter is work Martin? Is a sediment filter really needed with most municipal water supplies?
I’ve considered setting up a whole-house water filter…would that plus the RO carbon filter likely remove enough chloramine to keep the membrane safe?
The things to consider when purchasing an RO system are the replacement filter costs and availability. The RO membrane that does the work of removing the salts from water will last a very long time but the sediment filter and carbon filter should be replaced every 6 months.
I have used the least expensive GE model from Home depot. Two in my current house (one for my use and one for related living) and one as a replacement to a Kinetico in a previous house. I am 99.99% sure that GE does not make it (except maybe the membrane from GE Osmonics). Many suppliers that we as consumers use purchase the components from the same companies.
They will all produce water at around 30-40 uS/cm (15-20 ppm TDS) which is extremely low. It is not high purity water at 18.2 mohm (0.055 uS/cm) but that is not necessary and very costly. I believe it cost us around $1500 when we have to have a DI beds changed for the water used by R&D.
To put in perspective
Groundwater in Chicago area = 1000 uS/cm (500 ppm)
Lake Michigan = 300 uS/cm (150 ppm)
At a drinking water plant in the NW (if i remember they draw from the Clackamas River in Oregon) the EC was very low at 30-40 uS/cm. I thought the meter was reading wrong since it was so low and was close to RO water. Calibrated and checked. Sure enough that was the reading. Most likely the area is granite and there are no minerals to dissolve that would increase the EC unlike Chicago where there is a lot of limestone.
http://www.homedepot.com/p/GE-Reverse-Osmosis-Filtration-System-GXRM10RBL/202073853
HD Replacement carbon filters @ $11.50 (2 pack)
http://www.homedepot.com/p/HDX-Carbon-Household-Filter-2-Pack-HDX2CF4/205373472
HD Pleated filters @ $9.00 (2 pack)
http://www.homedepot.com/p/HDX-Pleated-Household-Filter-2-Pack-HDX2PF4/205373484?MERCH=REC--PIPHorizontal1_rr--205373472--205373484--N
More expensive GE unit that uses their twist and lock filters
http://www.homedepot.com/p/GE-Twist-and-Lock-Reverse-Osmosis-Filtration-System-PXRQ15RBL/202616787
For GE twist and lock the replacement filters are $40.
http://www.homedepot.com/s/GE%2520RO%2520filter?NCNI-5
These write-ups are all great reading. I am contemplating building a portable (mounted on a cart) system using an off-the shelf solution such as one of the above G.E. systems.
I already use a carbon filter cartridge to strip the chlorine from my municipal water supply. It is connected to an outdoor garden hose bib. In between uses, I drain it and let it dry. I would use the same hose bib to supply a portable RO system.
With these RO systems, is doing the same thing I’m doing with my carbon filter (breaking them down to let them try out between uses) a good or practical thing to do? Would it affect their useful life. I would just be concerned about the possible growth of unwanted microbes if they sat full of water for an extended period of time between uses.
Thanks in advance!