I’d have to have it side by side to say for sure, but I think the flavor is a touch more bready and “full”. Geez, I’m the guy who bitches about “juicy” and then I go and say that!
That’s a good enough description for me. ;D Thanks.
It’s interesting that the beers were very similar yet a significant number of people could tell them apart. Something to please everyone there. I do wonder if the difference might have been slightly more perceptible if a yeast with more subtle flavour was used, eg German lager.
I don’t step mash and don’t intend to start. If I had a Braumeister I might well do it for certain recipes. Seems more trouble than it’s worth for normal homebrew setups.
Lager yeast actually converts less ferulic acid to 4-vinyl guaiacol because lager brewers don’t want that nasty stuff in their bier, hence why I previously stated that the yeast should have been a weissbier yeast to maximize the conversion.
I guess it depends on what you’re testing. If you’re specifically testing the production of 4VG via a ferulic acid rest, then something like 3068 is the way to go. If you’re testing whether a step mash affects body or other detectable differences in a non-POF+ style beer (if that makes sense), then a Helles using a clean lager yeast and something like a Hochkurz mash schedule would probably be what I’d shoot for.
I also would like to try this malt. how do you compare it with Floor Malted Bohemian Pils?
I want to try this malt so bad!
I’ve mashed for different lengths, 15-120 minutes, many side by side, and I honestly can tell a difference.
Well, I think the Belgian yeast covers up anything you’ll be able to reliably tell, although 66 tastes could tell, which I thought was staggering.
A future exbeeriment would be to test a 60/60 145/162F step mash on a helles. And I’m surprised there was no mention of the mouth feel of the beer. The hochmash was short, but should’ve provided at least a bit more body. And someone mentioned earlier about no wheat being used, which is typically the main malt when used in conjunction with a ferulic acid rest.
I definitely think there is some merit to step mashing. Do you think the Germans would spend so much time making their excellent beer if it was all for naught? I know I can perceive a difference. Even if it’s subtle, it takes, what would be a good beer, to a great beer.
Dave, I don’t think beta and alpha amylase enzymes are working at full power in a 150F rest. Just like yeast, there are temperature ranges where they work best and provide the most benefits to the wort profile.
yep difference in ale vs lager yeast and starch conversion…"Starch conversion is the most important aspect of mashing. In barley starch makes up 63% - 65% of the dry weight. Starch is a polysaccarid (very large chains of glucose) which is insoluble in water. Brewer’s yeast, however, can only ferment monosacharides (glucose), disacharides (maltose) and trisacharides (matotriose). The latter can only be completely fermented by lager yeast strains (s. uvarum).- Kai
http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=The_Theory_of_Mashing
not arguing or trying to convince otherwise-as Ive come to my own conclusions based upon my experiences. if done correctly-time, temp, ph , and perhaps if your able to discern differences (might be genetic disposition related to taste and senses) then you will see a difference…just my opinion.
My last pils used Bestmaltz pilsner malt at 150f for 60 minutes that turned out really good and I can’t see where all the trouble of a step mash would improve it enough to make it worthwhile.
might not…might. you’d have to try to decide.
A general trend is emerging with people experiencing positive results with a 60/60 Hochkurz.
and its nothing new. been going on for at least 100’s of years probably. end of the day- yes it’ s more time vs single infusion. so with that you would have to try, evaluate, and decide for yourself if its what you want to do or not. really-that’s the fun in brewing for me.
Yep, cheers to that. Gotta take in all this cool info and spin it into your own style.
Amen. The only thing that truly ever ruffles my feathers on this forum is when someone says " I never , so it’s not true…or I did, so its fact".
Well, like I’ve said, the Germans don’t cut corners because it is worth the time, effort, and cost to them. They wouldn’t bother with it otherwise.
I wish I didn’t perceive a difference…gives me couple hours back each brew day!
I just meant it as a positive comment.
No worries, understood.
Are you sold on your new steam method? I’m going to try it on my next Tripel.