I didn’t realize he was ramping so high and early. I pretty much do F.
Now I have done a fair amount of fermentation with 2124. Some people had a chance to taste the results. I fermented from lagers to ales and even a little bit of Belgian. This is a very versatile and clean yeast.
Now can you tell me what is a difference between ale vs lager? Made them all with the same yeast.
Happy brewing.
[quote=“charles1968, post:13, topic:22447, username:charles1968”]
Yes, but it’s not a typical fermentation schedule for lager. Most people warm up at the end for a diacetyl rest, not halfway through. Both lagers were fermented mostly warm. Arguably what the experiment shows isn’t that temperature doesn’t matter but that the fast fermentation schedule doesn’t work.
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It’s more typical than you might think, especially among homebrewers.
The fermentation schedule Marshall espouses (and I use from time to time, though I have proven myself to be too lazy to adopt full-time, despite many good results, admittedly) may be somewhat yeast dependent for consistently good results. I am fairly convinced that the use of certain yeasts really require a more traditional approach due to flocculation rate, diacetyl reduction abilities and flavor profile development. But I fine infrequently and that may be integral to Marshall’s approach, also.
Pretty clean does not equal lager clean. And it was a 30 bbl batch that I didn’t want in the market place.
Almost 1000 gallons down the drain, I understand protecting the brand, but was it a tough call to not sell in tap room at least? Or was it an easy call? I know which of my homebrews that I would not pass around to friends, but I got through it. Different scale I understand. And I know megas dump more for less issues for the same reason(s). Just curious, no criticism
Am I the only one who ferments lagers at 50°F for a month, then kegs and lagers at 32°F for 6 weeks? I never let my lagers get above 50°F.
I brewed with WLP833 once in the low 60s and ended up with a fruit bomb.
I started the quick lager method when it was posted by Tasty McDole, a guy known to make pretty good beer. I consider my palate pretty good and I can’t find any difference from lagers I made the long, time consuming way. Except I’m a better brewer now, so I like them better. To each his own though.
These days, you may be. The fast lager schedule is nothing new. I believe it comes from Narziss? You should try it. I can make lagers every bit as good as the “old fashioned” (YOUR) way in a fraction of the time. As long as you keep the temps low for the first 3-7 days, there are no ill effects I’ve found to raising it after that. A week or two of lagering and they’re done.
In my experience, some of my maltier lagers continue to improve up to maybe 6 weeks or so of cold conditioning. But by that time the keg is half empty because it’s good enough after 2 weeks and I can’t keep myself from stealing “samples” a pint at a time every few days.
I don’t typically fine my beers, so that may have something to do with it.
Easy call, but not a call I take lightly. Not something I feel obligated to defend either. It’s my business and my reputation. I’ve been doing this for over 5 years - bad batches of beer bight you in the ass - even if they are somewhat drinkable. You think it is easy to sell 1000 gallons of sub par beer in a tasting room? You realize that tasting rooms are designed to showcase the BEST beer you can brew, right? We use our tasting room to showcase our brand, not to dump crappy beer down throats to make a buck.
FTR I was on the line about the beer. It wasn’t terrible but had a “homebrewy” character to it that was not up to my standards (and I mean “homebrewy” not to offend any experienced homebrewers. You guys know what I mean.) It was a lager yeast that fermented at 80. It was surprisingly clean. But far from something i felt comfortable shipping under our brand.
Major, I meant no offense, as referenced at the end of my post. I was just curious, not questioning your call. I feel I would be lucky to get to a point where I have to make that call. Again, no offense was intended and I was not asking you to defend your call or question your brewing skills.
Brulosophy didn’t do an exbeeriment on the higher temp ferment, but he did write a pretty detailed post on it. I started doing this after jamil talked about it (and I believe wrote about it in the Yeast book). I have loved the results as have a fair number of my fellow judges in comp conditions. Admittedly, I have only done it with 34/70 and 2206.
One of the things I often feel is missing from these experiments is answering the question “What did the beer taste like?” We know the beers we’re indistinguishable but the article for this experiment doesn’t provide tasting notes. I assume both beers were good and true to style, but, actually that is not stated. So, it’s just an assumption on my part.
I realize taste is subjective. But, if both beers are indistinguishable but taste like crap then the results are less meaningful than if both beers fit there target style and taste good.
Ageing is an interesting issue. Hard to test experimentally as you’d have to stagger the brews, which introduces extraneous variables. My beers definitely improve with age but it’s at least partly because I bottle condition rather than kegging & force carbonating. It takes at least 3 weeks for a beer to fully attenuate and carbonate after bottle priming. If cold stored the beer continues to clear and lose chill haze over many weeks,
I think the improvement in taste could be a subjective thing. If you drink the same beer over a long period, you develop an acquired taste for it and it seems nicer and nicer. The first time I made Schwarzbier I didn’t really care for it. By the time I had only a few bottles left, I loved it - but other people who tried it for the first time weren’t that keen.
If fermenting completely warm with 34/70 produces the same beer, as the recent exbeeriment suggests, then the fast method could be even faster with no loss of quality.
Didn’t take it as such, no worries. I’m just sayin’, its a different world on the commercial side. And , yeah, had it been a five gallon homebrew batch I probably would have kegged it, drank half and then dumped it for something better! Cheers!
Has anyone ever tried this with S-189? I am looking to make a hybridish beer, primarily to grow yeast for a pitch on our larger system for a helles then maibock.
Have heard great things about this yeast, but was planning on fermenting at around 60* (basically a modified CAP grain/hop bill)