Was going to do a table saison but am using T58 which I assume won’t work for that. Probably going to shoot for 5% ABV or so. My original plan was to go with my saison recipe but just scale down the amounts accordingly. Maybe this is more like a belgian pale ale?
T58 gave me 85% attenuation for a recent wit that I mashed at 152. Should I remove the table sugar and keep the mash temp high? Should I add some aromatic or specialty malt?
I like my beers dry so I was considering just leavin the table sugar in and mashing at 147 like I would do for a saison. Input?
I might bump the munich a bit from your norm if you are going for table strength and super dry. the maltiness will help it not feel too thin. and then just pump the carbonation up a bit to give it a full mouthfeel and it should be tasty and easy drinking.
That is similar to a recipe I have been working on. I want to use 85% pilsner and 15% munich, but I am shooting for a lower abv - maybe around 4.5% or even lower. I am a little worried about the body of the beer being to thin so I think I will just mash really high - around 158F and hope for the best.
I am also considering a very light touch of honey in the fermenter and possibly a little spice addition at the end of the boil. Coriander or chamomile have come to mind. I am planning on using wy3522 Ardennes yeast on one half of the batch and 3422 Belgian Wheat on the other.
Yours is going to be quite hoppy with 3 oz of aromatic hops, and I am not sure I would like that as much. The idea for me is to let the yeast be in the lead, then the malt, and then the hops take a back seat. I like a hoppy saison, but I don’t think t58 is really a saison yeast, is it?
From what I understand T58 should not be used for saisons although some have reported doing just that. I just adapted my saison recipe though am not expecting one.
I only have 1.5 oz in the last 20 min not 3.
I was going to drop the ABV even further but I have a 4.4% session ale on now so I don’t think it is necessary. I don’t know exactly what the threshold for a ‘table beer’ is so I guess this would more likely just fit into belgian specialty? Most of the beers I brew are hybrids anyway so I am not too worried about categories…
T-58 IMO is close to a wit strain than a saison or abbey strain but these are all strains that share a number of traits so their interchangeable use is not unreasonable.
I’m not sure 5% qualifies as table beer. Table beer is usually 2% ABV or less. Basically a replacement for water at the dinner table. There are beers floating around commercially with that label at twice that strength, much like 5-6% session beers. :
I brew several saisons in the ~4% ABV range and even with the great attenuation of saison strains still do not come out with thin or watery beers. One of my base recipes for saison is very similar to your recipe, minus the table sugar. They are definitely dry but not watery. If your goal is to create something more along the lines of a Belgian blond than a saison then you might want a little more body than a saison would have at that strength. The table sugar would then be unnecessary. Depending on the attenuative power of T-58 that might be enough to create the body you need without worrying about moving mash temperatures up or down.
Thanks for informing me about the term ‘table beer’. I was pretty much just equating it to a ‘session beer’. I think I will go with something similar to what I have posted for a first attempt. I rarely nail a first attempt for my tastes anyway so it will likely need tweaking regardless…
I have only used T58 once for a wit. I will keep the table sugar just to get the attenuation as high as possible. I was suprised I got 85% out of the first time so I think I can get it close to 90% for a pretty dry beer.
That is good to hear. I am not worried about T58 just thought I couldn’t use it for a saison. I will stick with it since I have it on hand.
This batch is getting some crabapples in fermenter as well. I haven’t decided on amounts yet because I don’t want to overdo it. The good thing is these guys are slightly more tart than a granny smith and quite edible.
You can call it whatever you want, but to me you can’t get a true saison without a saison yeast strain. It’s like brewing a hefe without a hefe yeast - the yeast character is inherent in the definition of the style. Having said that, this only really makes a difference in the name. Whatever you call it, it sounds like a tasty brew.
I don’t disagree to a big extent, Joe. IMO Saison is a beer that is at least partly about technique - mash low, finish really low. I had batches with 3724 that stalled and never got below 1.010ish - the yeast character was good but the beer had too much body left. Was that saison ? I don’t know, probably, maybe not. I just think you need both - attenuation and the unique,earthy yeast character. And I have had plenty of Hennepin and I like it regardless. At the end of the day I agree, good beer is good beer.
B) If I brewed Hennepin, I don’t think I’d call it a saison. I’d probably call it a spiced Belgian Blonde. I guess it’s not right or wrong either way; that’s just how I think of it. Beer nomenclature is a silly thing.