We asked you for your questions and did you come through. In this first of two parts, Denny and Drew are joined by Mr. How-to-Brew himself, John Palmer to trawl the stormy seas of homebrew questions in search of our white whales. (Don’t forget you can always ask us questions at podcast@experimentalbrew.com
Denny,
I have to say that I was very surprised that John said no one is doing LODO brewing. They do it in Germany, in the medium to large modern breweries. No one there uses NMeta to remove to O2, that is not RHG compliant. What is RHG compliant is the use of stripping column to remove the O2 by bubbling C02 up through the water. I’ve seen the water treatment room at Schönram where this is done.
My 2¢ is that you if you want to brew the best example of the style, use ingredients and processes that make the style in its home. One needs to brew differently for Lambics than for Light German lagers.
The smaller family owned breweries with old brewing systems don’t brew that way, as it is not financially possible to invest in the equipment. I asked a guy about hot side and Low Oxygen brewing. He said they are taught about it in brewing school. His system is from 1970, and not set up for it. What he does, and recommends, is fill from the bottom and don’t splash. He says some breweries that don’t take any care are known for their house flavor. I’ve been to a few of those.
Denny, I’ll be curious to hear what you think of using a late-boil acid addition in IPA’s if you end up trying it out. I’m still dialing in my process, but I have really enjoyed the results so far. I’ve been handling this by adding citric acid with my dry hops, and it really brightens up the hop flavor in those beers.
I thought John’s comments about cold-IPA being a form of cream ale were good. It’s like a way to re-brand the cream ale to a younger crowd. I have one in the fermenter and might not dry-hop it just to maintain a bit of cream ale heritage in it.
The Elements of Cold IPA, According to Kevin Davey The grist is based on American adjunct lagers: 20 to 40 percent rice or corn, mashed with all-American two-row pilsner malt. There should be no caramel malt. The finished beer should be incredibly dry, fermented to 82 to 88 percent apparent attenuation. Lager yeast ferments the beer, but at relatively warmer temperatures, use faster-fermenting strains that produce low ester and low sulfur (such as Fermentis SafLager W-34/70). You can substitute clean-fermenting ale strains such as Chico, Kölsch, or California Common, as long as the sulfur and ester notes are low. “Cold IPA is a canvas for IPA hops,” Davey says. Dry hops go in “warm” before fermentation is complete, during spunding or kräusening. “This achieves biotransformation while negating oxygen pickup,” Davey says. The beer should be filtered to crystal clarity and well carbonated. “Cold IPA is the antithesis of New England–style IPA,” Davey says. —Joe Stange Cold IPA Style Parameters OG: 1.055–1.065 (13.5–16°P) FG: 1.006–1.009 (1.6–2.4°P) ABV: 6.4–7.9% IBUs: 50–70 Color: 2.5–5 SRM
This is an unsatisfying definition for me. It seems to me that a Cold IPA is defined by a process, rather than a result. I’ve brewed a handful of beers over the years with similar grist and hops, a similar flavor/body/aroma, but using a clean ale yeast. If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it’s still a duck if I brewed it warm with a clean ale yeast, right?
And I’ve brewed similar beers using lager yeasts over the years, but I just called them dry-hopped Pilsners. Not Italian Pilsners, IPL’s or Cold IPA’s. This seems like another superfluous style name to me.
The fact that there are so many definitions shows that no one knows. It’s whatever the brewer wants it to be. For every person who says it’s this, there’s another one who says it’s that.
Not sure I understand. I’m curious as to the other definitions for this style that you have found and how far from Davey’s they stray. With all due respect to Palmer, the Cold IPA’s I have had taste nothing like Cream Ales (ABV, bitterness, aroma…all vastly different). Unless, of course, there are other definitions for Cream Ale that I’m not aware of.
I think this is called “welcome to the uncomfortable birth of a style as designed by playing a game of Telephone”.
Kevin definitely gets the credit for the name - now everything else is going to take time to shake out in terms of what generally gets meant across the beer world - and right now it’s wibbley as hell and doesn’t even have the benefit of “Brut IPA” by design requiring enzymes.
