It’s in the fermenter and happily bubbling away! If you missed the other self adoring thread, check out my 15MB of fame here:
Anywho. It was interesting. The HLT is a dream, so is the kettle… Got some data on how much heat/liquid loss in the MLT and BK. I brewed the house APA, converted to AG. I’ll be able to compare it to my extract batch…if I don’t drink it first…
The only part I wasn’t too happy with was the rate at which the MLT drained…slow, VERY slow. What is “normal”? I thought the grind was a little fine (jsp Maltmill, fixed model) I will take and post a picture of the ground malt when I get a chance. In the end I think I cheated and did a little stirring in the mash around the screen to get it draining.
Well, lets see… two row pale malt, ten pounds say 28 points = 280 There was also 1/2 pound of Crystal and a half pound of Carapils so call that another 25 points for a total of 305… I ended up with 5.25 gallons at 1056 so call it 294 points… that puts me at 294/305*75=72.3%…so 72.5/75=96%…right?
I am not sure why you are multiplying by 75 and then dividing by 75, it just cancels itself out.
The chart I use puts 2row @ 36 ppg and the carapils and crystal @ 35
so that’s 360 + 35 for 395
5.25x56=294
294/395=.74
OK, understood. The 96% was my percentage of 75%, IOW how close did I get to the malter’s assumed brewhouse efficiency. We’re saying the same thing. Either way, I agree. Not bad for a first batch. I’m happy.
That still leaves my original question…how long should the mash tun take to drain?
My runoff’s usually take about 15 minutes or so but that’s with me leaving the cooler tilted and wort trickling out at the end. My total runoff time with initial runoff and sparging usually runs about 40 min.
I typically do 10 gallon batches of high gravity beers in a 10 gallon round Rubbermaid/Igloo/Gott cooler fitted with a 12 inch bazooka screen and spigot. We’re talking over 25 lbs of grains, usually.
Lautering takes 20 minutes.
1st Batch sparge 15-20 minutes.
2nd batch sparge 10-15 minutes.
Total time 45 minutes to an hour.
My wet mash often goes up to the 8 gallon mark on the inside of the cooler, so we’re talking a good 1.5 feet thick grain bed.
I’ve often wondered if my lautering/sparging would go faster if I went with a rectangular cooler, or a 12-inch round SS false bottom (with perforations or slotted manifold). What do y’all think?
I usually start the 20 gallon SS boil kettle once the first runnings (from lautering) is completed. I use a 5.5 gallon SS pot as my collection and transfer vessel during sparging. That way, once the 2nd sparge is nearly done, the wort is already boiling. Lautering and sparging isn’t taking too much time (unless I excessively crush my grains or do wheat beers w/o rice hulls–both have happened).
It depends on several factors. What kind of strainer are you using? (manifold,hose braid, etc…) I know you are using a rectangular cooler which will drain quicker than a round cooler. Density of the grain bed is another factor which is determined by the crush. Sticky type grains like wheat and rye tend to slow down the runoff. With your grist bill and your cooler using a hose braid for 5 gallons I would estimate roughly 10 min or less to drain.
Some of the issues that can hinder the runoff are the grist bill composition, depth of grain bed, crush, strainer design and lack of vertical drop to the BK.
I know you have a JSP Maltmill with a fixed factory setting which should be .039". Have you checked that mill gap setting?
Don’t worry so much about the time. With my system I’ve had to throttle it back halfway to keep from compacting the grain-bed. That’s a stuck-sparge BTW.
With batch-sparging my first run is always longer for some reason, maybe 10-15 minutes. ??? Even though the concept is: drain the tun as fast as possible you gotta respect how the wort makes its way to the braid. My grain-bed usually will remain quite loose until the level of wort drops below it’s surface and I don’t get any sort of channeling- which still can occur in batch-sparging. So you’ll have to reach a compromise between speed, time and ease of use. Going so fast one has to fix a stuck sparge doesn’t really save any time at all.
Yes try backing off on your grind. It will help your lauter. And mashing a few minutes extra doesn’t hurt either.
I use an adjustable JSP. I have the gap closed almost as far as it will go. From the time I start my mash runoff til the time I finish my sparge runoff takes 15 min. for about 8 gal. of wort. That includes vorlauf for the mash, adding the sparge water, and vorlauf for the sparge.
Wow, Denny! Then I probably should be thinking about a big blue rectangular cooler for my mash tun.
My 10 gallon round orange igloo cooler is probably compacting too much and slowing things down.
The grain bed is well over 12-18 inches in height usually.
Euge, I also notice that the sparge times get shorter as the SG of the runnings decrease with each batch sparge (less viscosity).
Denny…have you measured your mill gap setting on your JSP? I was just thinking that the millgap setting on your JSP might be a good benchmark for homebrewers trying to achieve an optimal crush.
If we assume the typical mill roller runout to be within .001", one should be able to find an effective gap of .002" in areas when fully closed. We know that a fully closed setting is not practical because the grain wouldn’t be able to pass through the mill. I see two factors to consider when setting your gap, one is the performance of the crush (passing speed) and the second being mash efficiency. Although I think passing speed takes a back seat to efficiency at least to me anyway. The density of the crush will directly effect the runoff. The finer the crush, the slower the runoff just as the coarser the crush, the faster the runoff. So dialing in the crush can effect several different parameters of the process. Perhaps we should prioritize the parameters and dial in the crush from that point. Personally, I think efficiency should come first.
Has anyone done any experimenation on mill gap setting vs. efficiency?
Nope, I’ve never measured it. Maybe I’ll remember to do that one of these days. I closed it all the way and then opened it enough so that I saw the rollers just barely move.
I’ve never heard of anyone doing this calculation before. What makes you think the maltster expects you to get 75% efficiency? I think the maltster expects you to get 100% conversion and then whatever lauter efficiency your system happens to have. I doubt they expect the professional breweries, for whom they produce most of their malt, to be getting only 75% mash efficiency.
As far as luater speed goes, I strongly suggest malt conditioning if you have trouble with slow runnings. I use a round cooler and a very tight gap, but get runoff as fast as my 1/4" ID valve will allow. Maybe 5 minute or so.
After listening to the BN episode on mash efficiency I have concluded that my grain may not be crushing properly. All the husks are shredded. So, I am going to try wetting them prior to grinding.
But first I will check the gap. In the middle of 5 days of running around the country. Brewing again wed or thu.