Haha! Not what I would call a ringing endorsement. It’s OK to have one less option.
Holy wow, you are really throwing in the cones lock, hop & barrel! That’ll make for a pricy-ipa, but very delicious I’d think. Since I’ve gone all organic hops with the accompanying higher prices, I haven’t dared a recipe that utilizes this many hops per gallon.
I wonder whether there’s a functional flavor-ceiling, after which adding more cones yields minimal impact. I’d like to home in on an optimal amount and manner of addition to maximize aroma and flavor–that point before one sees diminishing returns on those hop additions.
Looking forward to reading more about this one.
Just a quick update on this. I bottled this batch tonight. It looked, smelled and tasted like fresh squeezed pineapple-grapefruit juice. The bitterness level wasn’t overpowering despite the amount of fine hop debris that is still in suspension. I can’t wait until this carbs up to give it a real taste, but I think it might need a bit of extended cold-conditioning to help settle out as much of the hop trub as possible.
As a side note, I am officially swearing off using a combo of both cone and pellet hops for dry hopping with this large of a hopping rate. With one or the other you can easily get your siphon in a spot where you aren’t sucking up hop debris when racking. With both forms of hops it’s tough to see and find a spot where you can get and maintain a clean siphon. I kept losing suction, and rather than risking oxidation I ended up leaving at least a half gallon of beer in the fermenter and called it a night.
I have read that 100 ibus is kind of the threshold for bitterness, that the palate cannot tell if a beer is 100 or higher. Please correct me if I am wrong. Anyway, has anyone done a study on the flavor side of the equation? If someone through in a lb of flavor hops, they couldn’t tell if there was more after that. Making up the amount here.
Sorry to hijack, kind. I too would like to know the cost per pint.
I have used a stainless steel screen on the end of my dip tube to good success to remedy this. I also quit using pellet/whole hops. In fact, I use hop extract (Hop Shots) for my hugely bitter beers - got one in the fermenter now, quite tasty after 10 days. I do find that the bitterness from a Hop Shot tends to take about 4-5 weeks to really show up. For the first few days it’s a pale ale, then it transforms into an IPA, then it morphs in to an IIPA after a month. Really weird.
You’ve probably read that it’s the limit for the solubility of iso-alpha acids in wort. If you read the Hops book, you’ll find the answer to your other question, which is no. But people are working on it.
Cost per pint will vary on where you get your supplies and how. I buy in bulk, seasonally and on sale. This 4 gallon batch would have cost me $41.84, meaning $0.98 per 12 oz. ($0.55 higher than my normal batch).
I couldn’t wait any more, so I cracked into a bottle of this tonight. Carbonation is at a drinkable level, but still on the low side. The beer is hazy as hell.
The nose is big citrus. There’s grapefruit and pineapple predominantly along with some peaches and a hint of pine. The aroma could stand to be a little bit more powerful, but I think once the carbonation level picks up that will change.
As soon as it hits the palate - POW! It’s like drinking grapefruit juice with a shot of pineapple. The citrus is mouth-puckeringly potent. The beer itself is not tart, but boy does it ever play tricks on your palate from the massive impression of hops. The finish is more grapefruit, but then the stonefruit peach/plum character from the Meridian starts to show up a bit as well.
As the juiciness fades, the bittering level starts to show itself more. The bitterness is definitely there, but it isn’t abrasive at all. I’d equate it to about 60 IBU’s of FWH with no 60-minute addition. I sent off a sample for IBU testing, so it will be interesting what this one comes in at in the lab.
I’m sure the character will change somewhat once the carbonation picks up, but damn this is a good beer right now. It will also be interesting to see how the hop character changes over the course of a few months (if I can manage to save some for that long).
The citrus character is a bit overwhelming, so I’d probably cut the Nelson and/or swap out the Citra for something a bit more straight tropical as opposed to citrus-tropical next time. Maybe Galaxy or El Dorado. I’m glad I didn’t use any Crystal malt because this wouldn’t be as enjoyable if it was sweet. I’m picking up almost no malt character. I might try turning up the volume on the malt just a bit. I’m thinking maybe using Aromatic instead of Victory next time. And regardless of what the lab tells me, the impression of bitterness could come up a notch or two. I might do a small 20-25 IBU addition of Columbus at 60 minutes.
I will definitely be developing this further as my standard IPA recipe. Hop flavor is off the charts and I think 2 oz/gallon for dry hops is at or above the point of diminishing returns. The only thing I’d consider changing with dry hops would be to split them into 2 separate additions to see if that pushes the aroma even higher.
I’m definitely looking forward to trying this using hops that push the dank/piney side of things more to see how that turns out. If fruity hops = fruit juice IPA, what will Chinook/Simcoe/Columbus give you?
Definitely sounds interesting. Thanks for the feedback !
Dammit…it’s 8 AM and now I want a beer!
Piney cat pee?
Right now this beer would certainly pass for alcoholic fruit juice. Sounds like the perfect breakfast drink to me!
The lab results are in. Even though it’s only 1 data point, this seems to lend pretty strong support to the 100IBU ceiling on a beer. The testing took a bit longer than I hoped, but for 5 bucks you can’t go wrong with what they’re offering at http://coastalsciencelabs.com/
[quote]Hello Eric,
The results for your sample are listed below:
Sample IBU Std Dev
Sample 1 97.8 0.1
Bud (12) 10.9 1.2
Boston Lager (30) 31.8 0.7
WW IPA (61) 60.4 0.1
If you have any questions, please let us know. If you like our services, please tell three friends about us. Thanks!
Yours,
James (Jim) Gawenis, PhD
CEO/Chief Chemist
Coastal Science Labs
[/quote]
As I was setting up for my Winter Warmer brewday today I noticed a 3lb bag of DME that I had forgotten about. I think I’m going to squeeze in an extra brew today. I figure I can win some brownie points with the wife by cleaning a couple of pounds of whole leaf hops out of the freezer.
I don’t know if these will all even fit in the kettle, but damn it I’m going to try like hell to stuff them all in there. Hopping rate in the kettle will be just over a pound per gallon. If I calculate a 90 minute hop stand as a 15 minute addition, then Tinseth gives me over 1500 IBU’s. That makes my inner hophead smile.
I think I’m actually going to have to turn the heat back on after I add my hops because at this high of a hopping rate they will probably chill my wort down lower than I want.
HOME BREW RECIPE:
Title: That’s What She Said IPA
Brew Method: Extract
Style Name: American IPA
Boil Time: 15 min
Batch Size: 2.25 gallons (fermentor volume) <— Yeah right! Be lucky to get a gallon if I squeeze the hops hard ???
Boil Size: 2.5 gallons
Boil Gravity: 1.053
Efficiency: 60% (steeping grains only)
No Chill: 15 minute extended hop boil time
STATS:
Original Gravity: 1.059
Final Gravity: 1.017
ABV (standard): 5.61%
IBU (tinseth): 1522
SRM (morey): 12.97
FERMENTABLES:
3 lb - Dry Malt Extract - Light (88.9%)
STEEPING GRAINS:
5 oz - German - CaraRed (9.3%)
1 oz - American - Midnight Wheat Malt (1.9%)
HOPS:
1 oz - Simcoe, Type: Leaf/Whole, AA: 11.9, Use: First Wort, IBU: 53.65
12 oz - Amarillo, Type: Leaf/Whole, AA: 9.5, Use: Boil for 0 min, IBU: 421.11
16 oz - Centennial, Type: Leaf/Whole, AA: 10.2, Use: Boil for 0 min, IBU: 602.85
3 oz - Simcoe, Type: Leaf/Whole, AA: 11.9, Use: Boil for 0 min, IBU: 131.87
6 oz - Simcoe, Type: Leaf/Whole, AA: 14.1, Use: Boil for 0 min, IBU: 312.51
2 oz - Columbus, Type: Pellet, AA: 13.6, Use: Dry Hop for 7 days
1 oz - Simcoe, Type: Pellet, AA: 12.2, Use: Dry Hop for 7 days
YEAST:
Fermentis / Safale - American Ale Yeast US-05
NOTES:
90 minute hop stand
Please do report back your post boil yield. I hope you get a beer out of this, you could probably ferment in a growler.
I think I’m going to line my fermenter with my BIAB bag and dump the whole kettle into it. This way I can squeeze the hell out of the bag to try to wring out every drop.
:o. Wow. Loves me some hop juice!
This is what 1 pound per gallon of flameout hops looks like. Good god. I might have actually gone too far on this one…
Next time just use hop extract instead of water.
:o :
There’s a fine line between hop bliss and madness…very,very fine :D . In 20 years I’ve met maybe 1 or 2 people that hop heavier than me in American styles, but you are there. Can’t wait to read on this one !