If NAB buys Magic Hat...

[chrisinestes]

If NAB buys Magic Hat, is Magic Hat instantly not a craft brewry?

[beerocd]

Are you talking about their beer - or what their tax bracket should be  ;)

It’s interesting, and I’m not sure it happens anywhere else (another example escapes me right now) but I think normally when a small fish is bought by a big fish that would be considered a success and they have become part of one of the largest _________ companies in the world. But when it happens to a small brewery - they struggle to continue being considered small/craft.

My vote is they are craft-y or craft-like but no longer craft.

[chrisinestes]

@beerocd

Are you talking about their beer - or what their tax bracket should be  ;)

It’s interesting, and I’m not sure it happens anywhere else (another example escapes me right now) but I think normally when a small fish is bought by a big fish that would be considered a success and they have become part of one of the largest _________ companies in the world. But when it happens to a small brewery - they struggle to continue being considered small/craft.

My vote is they are craft-y or craft-like but no longer craft.

If it’s the same beer, why isn’t it craft beer any longer? It’s the same beer!

[chrisinestes]

@beerocd

I get married, I make the same money, I am no longer single nor do I fill out the same tax forms anymore. Why can’t I still be considered single; everything still looks, feels and works the same.  ;D

It’s the definition of craft that is the problem; we’re probably both right. I see craft as cottage industry. You can’t be part of a multibillion dollar global conglomerate and still claim to be the little guy. You can still (possibly) make good beer though, until the pencil pushers make you change something for the bottom line. Maybe a new term should be invented for beer that is tasty coming from the large guys and leave the term “craft” alone.

Good point. A new word… I’ll buy that… how about Kraft?

[rabid_dingo]

Not to mention, how many processes are affected when corporate trickle down arrives. How many corporate policies get imposed?
No more this, no more that. This SOP must be followed etc etc…

I would have to honestly say that as a fan of MagicHat in Colorado I only get to sample their wares when I convince a flight attendant to bring me some…They don’t distribute this far west. That could change, the only pro in my opinion…a larger distribution area, but of course that comes from a larger output thus pushing further away from “Craft” sized…

[system]

@chrisinestes

If it’s the same beer, why isn’t it craft beer any longer? It’s the same beer!

Not that I think Magic Hat is really doing anything for craft beer, but that’s a little bit naive.

Aside from the market pressures that can cause a large corporate owner to change the recipes/product line/distribution of a subsidiary, there are other more obvious impacts.  Look at how InBev closed the original Hoegardden brewery, or how Old Dominion in VA (bought by investors including AB a few years ago) has just closed their operation there to consolidate to a larger plant.  Even if the beer is great  (and that’s a big if), big companies have investors and the motivating factors are different.  It could be good, but it’s not craft.

[hokerer]

@narvin

Aside from the market pressures that can cause a large corporate owner to change the recipes/product line/distribution of a subsidiary, there are other more obvious impacts.  Look at how InBev closed the original Hoegardden brewery, or how Old Dominion in VA (bought by investors including AB a few years ago) has just closed their operation there to consolidate to a larger plant.

Not that is has anything to do with this thread, but some of the guys from the original Dominion Brewing are starting back up not far from the old place…

Finally, the 28 North Brewhouse on Red Rum Drive in Ashburn, Va., should debut this fall, promises brewer Favio Garcia. The brewery is in an industrial park a mile-and-a-half of where the Old Dominion Brewing Co. used to be. In fact, Garcia and partner Matt Hagerman used to work for Old Dominion, and managed to acquire their old 25-barrel brew house.

…from the Washington Post http://voices.washingtonpost.com/all-we-can-eat/beer/beer-dcs-impending-brewery-boo.html

[theprofessor]

“Craft” has nothing whatsoever to do with the size of the brewery.  They may cease to be considered “artisanal” , but still be a “craft” beer.
Actually, they’re not very high on my list of craft brewers to begin with, but that’s just my opinion.  They do have a following, hence, the aquisition reports.  Kudos to them.

But really,  with the bigger brewers reaching back to tradition and beginning to make beers of more character, the  term “craft” is becoming a bit muddled.
“Craft”  doesn’t (and shouldn’t)  apply only to small brewery product.

[system]

They’re no longer micro, independent, artisinal, but they’re still craft?

These guys say otherwise.  And they have the domain, so that must count for something 

http://www.craftbeer.com/pages/beerology/small-independent-traditional

[tmaurer]

I’ve always thought breweries like Magic Hat to be sort of campy.  Even their Odd Notion series are mostly uninspiring and dull.  I’ve bought many cases of Magic Hat, and I’ve even toured the brewery.  While there, the place was run strictly as a business.  It seemed lacking of the passion that most craft brewers have for the art.

I don’t think size determines what is craft or not.  It’s the passion that is put into the brew.  I don’t think that Magic Hat has the passion anymore.  Just my 2 cents.

[akr71]

In my part of the world Unibroue was bought by Sleemans, which was bought by Sapporo.  IMO, you don’t buy a brewery like Unibroue (or Magic Hat) and start monkeying with their product to push out fizzy yellow water.  There’s enough of that on the shelves already.  A big brewery buys an established small ‘craft’ brewery to get their foot in the door of the fastest growing segment of the industry.

I would expect NAB to take a hands-off approach when it comes to daily operations.

[weithman5]

I am not too in to craft as a definition.  And big breweries can brew “craft brews” eg beach bum blonde ale.  I went to a tasting this weekend of about 30 different “craft beers”  and they all tasted crappy.  I would still rather drink a bud than that swill when i am in the mood for just something cold and refreshing.  Bottom line is if they produce a product that is worth spending your hard earned gold on then it is a good beer.

[system]

@akr71

In my part of the world Unibroue was bought by Sleemans, which was bought by Sapporo.  IMO, you don’t buy a brewery like Unibroue (or Magic Hat) and start monkeying with their product to push out fizzy yellow water.  There’s enough of that on the shelves already.  A big brewery buys an established small ‘craft’ brewery to get their foot in the door of the fastest growing segment of the industry.

I would expect NAB to take a hands-off approach when it comes to daily operations.

That’s what you’d hope, but look at all the historic breweries in Europe that closed once they were purchased by InBev, and how the beers aren’t the same anymore.  I’m not saying it’s a matter of time for Unibroue, but… well, maybe it is?

[system]

@weithman5

And big breweries can brew “craft brews” eg beach bum blonde ale.

So, any beer that isn’t an American Light Lager is craft?

I’m not saying that “small, independent, traditional” is the perfect definition of craft beer, but this makes even less sense to me.  Craft beer is not a style of beer.

[beerocd]

@narvin

So, any beer that isn’t an American Light Lager is craft?

I’m not saying that “small, independent, traditional” is the perfect definition of craft beer, but this makes even less sense to me.  Craft beer is not a style of beer.

How about this. Keebler elves can NOT make home-made cookies. They can make very good cookies and by contrast many home-made cookies SUCK. So just because Ernie the elf makes a great cookie, does not make it home-made

Now, if Yellowhammer made BMC-ish beers  - is that craft? I say it is - someone will think it’s a great beer, made by a small, independent, traditional, low volume brewer. The same beer, made by BMC - is not craft beer.

[weithman5]

Again why i don’t like the idea of “craft beer” monicker. and yes i think american light lagers are good beers and can be brewed with great “craftmanship”  i think some people drink crap beer just because it is from a “craft brewery”  and i still think large breweries can make good beers.

[bluesman]

@beerocd

@narvin

So, any beer that isn’t an American Light Lager is craft?

I’m not saying that “small, independent, traditional” is the perfect definition of craft beer, but this makes even less sense to me.  Craft beer is not a style of beer.

How about this. Keebler elves can NOT make home-made cookies. They can make very good cookies and by contrast many home-made cookies SUCK. So just because Ernie the elf makes a great cookie, does not make it home-made

Now, if Yellowhammer made BMC-ish beers  - is that craft?I say it is - someone will think it’s a great beer, made by a small, independent, traditional, low volume brewer. The same beer, made by BMC - is not craft beer.

Wikipedia - A craft is a skill, especially involving practical arts. It may refer to a trade or particular art.

By definition, I agree in that the intent of the process at the end of the day is to acheive a product that was targeted for it’s quality as the main focus utilizing the skills of talented brewers and not for the sole purpose of financial gain however large or small the brewery may be.

In the case of Magic Hat that remains to be seen as the direction or focus of the business may be redirected.

Can craft beer be bad?  sure it can…

Is all craft beer good beer?  …you be the judge

It’s the act of creating a product with the use of sound brewing skills, brewing knowledge and an artful spirit that are all incorporated into the creation of craft beer.

[akr71]

@narvin

@akr71

In my part of the world Unibroue was bought by Sleemans, which was bought by Sapporo.  IMO, you don’t buy a brewery like Unibroue (or Magic Hat) and start monkeying with their product to push out fizzy yellow water.  There’s enough of that on the shelves already.  A big brewery buys an established small ‘craft’ brewery to get their foot in the door of the fastest growing segment of the industry.

I would expect NAB to take a hands-off approach when it comes to daily operations.

That’s what you’d hope, but look at all the historic breweries in Europe that closed once they were purchased by InBev, and how the beers aren’t the same anymore.  I’m not saying it’s a matter of time for Unibroue, but… well, maybe it is?

Well then, we can hope that Europe starts experiencing a craft beer revolution like is going on in North America… :'(  Love 'em or hate 'em Brewdog seems to be trying to start one in the UK.