different forms of wheat

[goschman (Iliff Ave)]

What are the main differences in regards to flavor, body, etc when using wheat malt, flaked wheat, or torrified wheat?

[dmtaylor (Dave Taylor)]

Excellent question.  I dare anyone to provide an answer based on real life side-by-side experimentation.  I myself do not have this answer.  I use them pretty much interchangeably based on whatever I happen to have on hand or whatever is on sale.

[goschman (Iliff Ave)]

@dmtaylor

Excellent question.  I dare anyone to provide an answer based on real life side-by-side experimentation.  I myself do not have this answer.  I use them pretty much interchangeably based on whatever I happen to have on hand or whatever is on sale.

Thanks. I think I have read before that torrified can add a slightly nutty or biscuity character. For the amount I will be using any differences will probably be negligible.

[dmtaylor (Dave Taylor)]

@goschman

Thanks. I think I have read before that torrified can add a slightly nutty or biscuity character. For the amount I will be using any differences will probably be negligible.

I’m pretty sure that’s just theoretical.  Munch on some and see what you get in real life.

[jonhughey_att.net (HoosierBrew)]

Torrefied (though it’s a bi##h to crush) has a sort of popcorn character to it that the other forms don’t have IMO. Past that, I’m not a huge wheat beer guy so I’ll leave the subtleties to the guys that brew them more.

Edit - When I brew a hefe its 50/50 or 60/40 malt:wheat malt. Flaked wheat along with wheat malt and barley malt in a wit.

[stpug]

Torrified definitely has a light toast quality to it that the other two do not.  Used in decently large amounts will contribute a very light nutty/popcorn quality to the beer, assuming that character is not overpowered by other factors.

The other two are basically interchangeable in my brewing practices.  They usually serve to lighten the overall malt flavors of the beer, as opposed to contributing a quality of their own.  Maybe in large proportion and in the right beer the unique wheat qualities can shine through.

[system]

Low oxygen wheat flavors are doughy, sort of like fresh bread dough(makes sense). I am only speaking of floor malted wheat, and white wheat though, thats all I use.

[goschman (Iliff Ave)]

Thanks all. This is only for an amount of 10% of the grain bill. I kind of assume I will get some responses that ‘at that amount, just remove the wheat completely’ but it is staying as I am just tweaking an old recipe.

[denny]

Flaked wheat is not malted and tastes like wheat.  Malted wheat has a malt flavor, like malted barley.

[hopfenundmalz]

You left out raw wheat. 

[dmtaylor (Dave Taylor)]

@hopfenundmalz

You left out raw wheat. 

Raw wheat makes it taste “juicy”.  Just add a tablespoon all-purpose flour to any IPA and it’s instantly awesome.  :o

I kid, I kid…  ;D 8)

[system]

Raw wheat has a place.  It’s not the same as AP flour, which doesn’t have the germ or the bran.  It’s obviously used in traditional Belgian lambics with a turbid mash but I’ll throw 10% in Saisons, IPAs, and other beers.  It’s going to be similar to flaked wheat, but it’s cheaper.

[rookie_l_a (Steve Ruch)]

Torrefied (though it’s a bi##h to crush) has a sort of popcorn character to it that the other forms don’t have IMO.

Does it actually need to be crushed?

[jonhughey_att.net (HoosierBrew)]

Torrefied (though it’s a bi##h to crush) has a sort of popcorn character to it that the other forms don’t have IMO.

Does it actually need to be crushed?

I always crush it under a finer gap. It has that hard exterior - I just want to get to the stuff inside.

[pmorrissette (Phil_M)]

I’ll second torrified wheat adding a popcorn/slight nutty flavor.

[denny]

@hopfenundmalz

You left out raw wheat. 

To me, pretty much the same flavor as flaked.

[erockrph]

Torrefied (though it’s a bi##h to crush) has a sort of popcorn character to it that the other forms don’t have IMO.

Does it actually need to be crushed?

I’d recommend it. They don’t dissolve readily (I learned that the hard way once). Think of them as Rice Krispies cereal - it would kinda suck if they dissolved in milk.

[hopfenundmalz]

@denny

@hopfenundmalz

You left out raw wheat. 

To me, pretty much the same flavor as flaked.

My memory is numb on all the information given as it was while drinking a pint after a competition our club put on, a buddy asked Jolly Pumpkins Ron Jeffries (BoS judge), what he thought the differences were. He had an opinion on each one, and would use different forms for different beers, depending on flavor, mouthfeel, appearance and I forget what else. For a guy who is usually pretty quiet, he expounded for a long time.

[scott.milroy_usm.edu (Mythguided Brewing)]

@dmtaylor

Excellent question.  I dare anyone to provide an answer based on real life side-by-side experimentation.  I myself do not have this answer.  I use them pretty much interchangeably based on whatever I happen to have on hand or whatever is on sale.

I actually did this when I really started getting into all-grain recipes - I compared red vs. white wheat malt & flaked wheat vs. torrified wheat.  By all means trust your own nose/palate, but here are the notes I took during my side-to-side comparisons:

Red Wheat Malt (Briess):  Wonderful flavor w/candy-like sweetness and very smooth mouthfeel; subtle wheat/malt aromas

White Wheat Malt (American):  Candy-like sweetness w/light honey flavors; very chalky mouthfeel; faint honey & caramel aromas

Flaked Wheat:  Thick, creamy mouthfeel w/subtle sweetness; faint “wheaties” aromas; zero fluid release - begging for a stuck sparge

Torrified Wheat:  Thick, creamy mouthfeel w/subtle sweetness; faint “wheaties” aromas; good fluid release

So flaked vs torrified wheat flavors and aromas were no different (to me), but I always use torrified just to avoid the possibility of a stuck sparge, and to receive more runnings.

I also tend to use Red Wheat Malt instead of the White, simply because I didn’t like the chalky mouthfeel of White Wheat Malt (but it definitely has more of a honey character to it).

[dmtaylor (Dave Taylor)]

I actually did this when I really started getting into all-grain recipes - I compared red vs. white wheat malt & flaked wheat vs. torrified wheat.  By all means trust your own nose/palate, but here are the notes I took during my side-to-side comparisons:

Red Wheat Malt (Briess):  Wonderful flavor w/candy-like sweetness and very smooth mouthfeel; subtle wheat/malt aromas

White Wheat Malt (American):  Candy-like sweetness w/light honey flavors; very chalky mouthfeel; faint honey & caramel aromas

Flaked Wheat:  Thick, creamy mouthfeel w/subtle sweetness; faint “wheaties” aromas; zero fluid release - begging for a stuck sparge

Torrified Wheat:  Thick, creamy mouthfeel w/subtle sweetness; faint “wheaties” aromas; good fluid release

So flaked vs torrified wheat flavors and aromas were no different (to me), but I always use torrified just to avoid the possibility of a stuck sparge, and to receive more runnings.

I also tend to use Red Wheat Malt instead of the White, simply because I didn’t like the chalky mouthfeel of White Wheat Malt (but it definitely has more of a honey character to it).

Fantastic assessment.  Thank you!  I will take a closer look at torrified, sounds like a winner.