I want to use up more of this past years fruit harvest from this past summer and fall that is taking up freezer space. I happen to be making a saison today and figured I would rack it onto some fruit after primary. I have raspberries, elderberries, wild grapes and peaches. I was leaning towards the grapes but wondered if that would be too intense. Any thoughts?
Grapes might make it appear dry, which wouldn’t b a bad thing. Split the batch and try two, grapes and something safe.
I’m dying to make a Saison with grape must (Muscat). I’d crush the grapes up , bag em, and use them in secondary .
The grapes and elderberries are definitely the most intriguing.
Same here. My thought is Gewurz or Sauv. Blanc with late Nelson Sauvin additions.
Yeah, Nelson was my thought, too. It’s definitely on the to do list.
Nelson + muscat = perfect match! Do it!
I don’t have any Nelson Sauvin but maybe I can get some in time to dry hop. I’m making the saison tomorrow and will be on retreat from wednesday Jan 7 to Jan 14 so maybe after then I’ll rack onto the grapes and some N.S. Dry hops that I’ll order. I have some cultivated white wine grapes I grew that I’ll mix with the wild ones to cut the tartness. I think I’ll put the elderberries in a ESB. " Your father smelled of Elderberries…"
YVH just got some nelson in stock.
I think I’ll go grape in secondary. I usually add a bit of sugar to saisons to accentuate dryness but I’m thinking with the grapes I’ll skip that. I might add 15% rye malt and the rest belgian pils. I’m using belle saison yeast.
Not really saison, but still, very dry beer: Cantillon makes two types of fruit lambic with grapes: Vigneronne, with Italian white grapes (I think very sweet muscat), and Saint Lamvinus, with (red) merlot and cabernet-franc from the Burgundy region.
In both cases instead of sugar a sweet liqueur is added to carbonate.
I’ve had some Cantillon beers, but not those. They sound great.
They do sound good. I ordered some Nelson sauvin. I’m going to rack onto our wild grapes and the ns hops after primary. Ended up with a grist of Bel pils, aromatic and wheat flakes. 1.064 OG . Buttered w/ tettnang late hops were ekg.
Auto correct turned bitter into butter.
Now I’m wondering if the grapes even though frozen will bring some wild yeast or other bugs to the party for good or ill.
certainly a possibility.
Now I’m going over how to add the frozen wild grapes in secondary. I’m concerned about contamination and or oxidation. If I go with grapes in a bag I can’t use a carboy so then I have a bucket with lots of surface area and a bag of grapes and hops floating on top. I’m thinking maybe puree the grapes and put in the carboy along with the Nelson S. hops and rack the saison on top (2.5 gallons in a 5 gal carboy, so plenty of headspace). Leave for maybe a week at 75ish then rack into smaller carboy and let sit in the cool cellar for a couple weeks around 50 degrees. (dry hop again closer to bottling?) Sound good? Definitely open to suggestions. This still doesn’t really address my contamination concerns. I suppose I could simmer the grape puree and add pectic enzyme. OTOH yeast from wild grapes might do wonders for finishing a saison.
I’d rinse the grapes thoroughly, spray them with Starsan, allow to drip off excess, and puree them (assuming they’re seedless). I’d pour through a strainer into the fermenter to separate most of the skin and rack the beer on top. BTW, I use a bucket for secondary on my fruit beers with no issue - you’re creating another CO2 blanket with the second fermentation. I’d hold off and dry hop in keg, assuming you keg. If not, wait until a week before bottling. My $0.02.
I bottle. I assume wild grapes have seeds, I think only cultivated grapes are seedless. I have a juicer, if the skins aren’t going in maybe I should just juice them.
No reason you can’t just crush them and add everything, EXCEPT for the racking nightmare. Even adding the crushed fruit in a bag takes forever to drip out all the liquid when you rack. If you can juice the grapes, you’ll be glad you did. Love the purees best for fruit beers.
EDIT - I’ve used a piece of women’s nylon hose over the racking cane which helps somewhat. It works great for filtering out hop particles, not as well with ‘goopy’ fruit pulp which clogs things easily.