So I brewed my first ‘to style’ kolsch. It is still carbing up and needs more cold conditioning but the differences compared to my ‘quasi-kolsch’ are astounding. I used continental malts vs domestic and a FWH addition of noble hops. I overshot my gravity and right now it doesn’t seem to be as delicate as I would like. It kind of reminds me of a less bitter Stella Artois which I am not sure is good or bad. It tastes more Czech pils to me.
My question is what negative impacts has anyone had using WLP029? There is still a lot of suspended yeast so I am curious if that is making the beer tastes stronger. Will carbonation and cold conditioning get me closer to that classic kolsch taste?
85% schill pilsner
10% schill Vienna
5% wheat
1.050 (overshot my OG by 3 points)
Tettnang FWH with some N brewer thrown in
~26 IBUs (I pushed this up a bit when I overshot my OG. Maybe it’s extra bitterness which is taking away what I am looking for?)
what PH did you hit in the mash? I pitch cooler with wlp029 (52F if i recall) . IBU and schedule, and everything else looks pretty good and similar to ones i’ve made.
5.4 mash pH, yellow balanced water profile. I have used 029 at these temps with good results so I am just wondering if my palate is confused by a more authentic version since this is something I rarely do. I think I definitely understand now people recommend continental malts for continental styles…
Yep. A lot of suspended yeast can give the beer a more harsh, bitter taste. I’d crash it for a few days (or a week). When a little more settles out, I think you’ll like a lot better.
62 beer temp or ambient? I use Wyeast 2565 which is supposed to be the same strain. I ferment at 58-60 ambient. 62 ambient is slightly high. Both yeasts are very low flocculating. I usually ferment for a couple weeks and then transfer and cold crash in a keg. After another couple weeks cold conditioning, I’ll check and transfer to another keg if it needs more clarifying.
Thanks. After I hit my FG I brought it down to 48F over the course of a week before kegging. A lot of the yeast dropped out but some did get to the keg. I fined with gelatin and It is now at 38F.
Beer temp it was very sluggish at 60F so I brought it up a little. Others here were saying these are different strains and from what I remember what clears a bit easier than the other. I have not tried 2565 yet…
I now have an amber on the slurry struggling along at 59F…I am fighting raising the temp and will let it rise naturally after a few days before crashing.
only used wlp029. it will go slower in the 50’s but moves along like a lager fermentation will. near the end i just ramp up to d-rest temps low to mid 60’s and finish up.
the drying finish, crispness but short of tartness, and decent carbonation level do tend to emphasize hops/bitterness a bit. Any yeasty or protein creaminess in this will hurt the impression IMO.
I have no experience with FWH in Kolsch. Hmm…
How’s the 029 yeast character right now?
my only issues with the yeast, which I love, is while it ferments better low, if there is not a good sized pitch it can struggle at low temp. My first effort with the yeast refused to work at all until warmed to 70F. At that temp it makes a decent amount of sulfur. When warmer it also makes the fruitiness, while still very pleasant, excessive for this delicate style. In such a case I had good results with 4/5 Kolsch and 1/5 American Light Lager in the keg to bring back into style range. But for you, too warm does not appear to be likely at 62.
…I’d give it a bit more time in the fridge and keep tasting as it clears.
Thanks for all of the feedback. In the past I probably have fermented 65-66F and got more fruity characteristics. I get too caught up in manufacturer recommendations which say it doesn’t ferment well below 62F. I realize they state this for those not using starters so that successful fermentation is more likely.
My past attempts had a small amount of late Amarillo hops so I can’t really compare them because the flavor profile has changed drastically…
I gave it shot after a recommendation by Wort-H.O.G. I believe. My tettnang were only 2.1% AA so I threw in a small amount of 10% N. Brewer to avoid having to use such a large volume. I think I will bump my IBUs down a bit next time to get my BU:OG below 0.5
When the ice is gone next week around the brewery, I’m brewing Kolsch 029 and Alt 036. I planned to ferment them at the same temp of 62-63. After this feedback I’m not sure. I normally use 2565 and got 029 after reading here. I don’t think 036 will handle the high 50’s.
WLP029 is a very clean fermenter that leaves the beer with a touch of apple and pear ester and tends to remind me a bit like chardonnay. This yeast can stall near the end if the temp is not raised up into the 60s, I have had it happen a few times, but it really works best if you can pitch at 58 and maintain this for a couple of days before ramping the temp into the low to mid 60s for the duration.
It is very powdery, low flocculating strain and can be a bugger to get to clear. But a little fining should do the trick.
BTW: The picture in my avatar is a crystal clear kolsch brewed with wLP029.
I read through the reviews on the WL site. Brewers used both 029 and 036 and stated their preferred temp was 57 for 029 and 52 for 036. Nothing like their recommended temps. I’m going to ferment both at 58 like you recommend and see what it turns out. I’m going to pitch at “lager” quantities. Thanks
I have noticed chardonnay qualities before as well but I am not getting them this time around. I ramped this up to 67F over a few days before crashing it. I got 84% attenuation which is about right from prior usage.
So should one pitch at the higher temp and dial down the ferment? WL states for 029, below 65 only if it is active. I was reading today on German lager techniques and it stated pitch at high end of yeast specs. Then wait until it is active and dial it to lowest end of yeast temp spec. I always thought you develop most of the undesirables during the beginning of the active fermentation? I’ve always pitched low end and kept it there when looking for a clean ferment. I’ve also found that their specs seam on the high side from my experiences.
I think you are right to pitch low. From what I have read recently, most pitch low, let rise a couple of degrees for most of the attenuation then finish a bit warmer before cold crashing.
If you pitch enough yeast you can go lower than White Labs advises as others suggest. It seems they are just covering their ass for those that don’t make starters. The first couple of times I used this yeast, I stayed between 65 and 69 as they suggested.
For me, when I think kolsch I think something that ferments at lower ale temps and then is lagered for a short amount of time. Low ale temps to me is 60-62 and there is no need to go lower other than preference. Obviously, I am here asking questions so take that for what it is worth.
yes enough yeast and you can pitch around 53-55 and let it rise and ferment at 58F with no issues. you do have to watch and be ready to ramp up a few degrees though as some say it can stall (i’ve not had this issue so far).
I have been sampling a couple ounces a day and the beer is improving. I get so obsessed that I can’t just let it sit…
It is clearing nicely and I am getting more of the kolsch character out of it. It is a little rough around the edges and it still has some likeness to a Czech pils or something. It is 5.5% ABV so I need to get that down and decrease the IBUs closer to 20 which should help. I plan to pick up some commercial kolsch for comparison soon.
Believe it or not, this is my first time using noble hops in about 6 years of homebrewing. I think my homebrew palate has become accustomed to American hops so it is throwing me off a bit. This beer is the most ‘authentic’ beer I have brewed to date and I think I am bit thrown off because it doesn’t have my normal house character.
After all this time, I am starting to fully realize that I kind of approached this hobby in a backward order.